Ep. 16 - NCAA Chaos & PLL Draft Reactions

[00:00:08] Welcome, welcome, welcome to The Run Out. I am your host, Neil Barrett. Whether you are a first time listener or you have been rocking with me for a little while now, I really appreciate you taking some time to check out the show and hopefully you enjoy it. I have been gone for a couple of weeks now. I know that I keep doing this thing where I'm gone for a couple of weeks and then I come back and I'm all excited and

[00:00:38] you know, I say, all right, we're going to do this and it's just going to roll forever now. And then after a couple of weeks, I'm gone for another couple of weeks. But this time, you know, honestly, the last few weeks, I just haven't felt like I had anything to say. I have sat down at this computer several times and tried to write out an episode and I just felt like there wasn't enough that I wanted to talk about that I wanted to say.

[00:01:08] I, it is one of the kind of downsides of me doing this on my own and not really having a co-host to kind of bounce off of and talk through things in all of the conversation falls on my shoulders. And if I don't have anything to say, then I don't really have a show.

[00:01:28] And I don't want to put out a show for the sake of putting out a show. I probably should. I probably should just be in the routine of doing this every single week, but I have not gotten to that point yet.

[00:01:45] And I just really have not felt like I had anything to say between, you know, Twitter and social media and Instagram and stuff like that. I said pretty much all of it. It was relatively small stuff. And I just haven't felt like there was enough for me to really warrant putting together a full episode of this podcast.

[00:02:10] But this week we have plenty to talk about with the conference championship weekend that just happened. Uh, the NCAA tournament starting this week. And of course we will be talking about the PLL draft that happened on Tuesday night.

[00:02:28] But before we dive in just a quick reminder to like subscribe, rate the show, whatever it is that the platform that you are checking out the run out on lets you do is do it. It really does help keep this show going. Also, I would like to build a community. I want you guys to interact with the show and talk with the show.

[00:02:51] So I tried doing a weekly question from you guys and that only went for a couple of weeks because people just stopped sending in questions. Hopefully now with the start of the PLL season, just around the corner and the NCAA season kind of hitting the prime like peak period.

[00:03:11] Maybe that will be something that sparks questions for you guys. If you have them, please send them in. But also again, like subscribe, comment, all that stuff, whatever it does. It really does help me keep this whole thing going. All right. That's enough of that and me begging for your participation without any further ado. Let's get into it.

[00:03:41] Conference championship weekend was an absolute blast. So many great games. I loved watching a lot of kind of the, you know, lesser quote unquote leagues play some of their early round games were incredible. And of course I absolutely loved seeing my Air Force guys as well as the university of Albany run to conference championships and earn their way into the NCAA tournament.

[00:04:08] Conference championship tournament. But the big one this weekend was of course the big 10 tournament at the university of Michigan. And I have to ask for at least one more time this season. Hot seat check.

[00:04:22] After winning the regular season, Ohio state added another feather in their cap this season, beating Maryland to win the big 10 tournament championship on Michigan's field. No less, which I know made it extra sweet for them, especially after Michigan won on the Ohio state field last year.

[00:04:49] But the question definitely remains. Can they add that final feather in their cap and win it all on Memorial day? The big 10 tournament as a whole was so much fun. And I actually think I watched all of the games from it this year, which is not something I think I can say I have ever done for the big 10. I'm not a big 10 guy. I don't, I don't know if that's apparent.

[00:05:17] Uh, obviously I'm a Duke guy and, uh, an ATC guy in that sense. Uh, big 10 has never really meant much to me, but the tournament was so much fun to watch this year. There were a lot of really good games. Uh, not a lot. There's only a handful of games in the tournament, but all of the games I thought were fun to watch enjoyable back and forth.

[00:05:40] Even the championship game, which, you know, Ohio state kind of got out to a lead and, and never really got all that close where you really thought Maryland was going to win. There was still always that thing in the back of your head that was like, yeah, but it's Maryland. And like even a three to five goal lead can evaporate like that. So all that to say again, the, the big 10 tournament was so much fun to watch.

[00:06:09] And I am really stoked for coach Myers and the Ohio state boys for finally winning their very first big 10 championship. Uh, again, they won the regular season championship and the, uh, big 10 tournament. It's the first time they've won either. And of course they won both in the same season. It has been an incredible season. And like I have talked about for most of the season,

[00:06:37] it's so funny to me that everyone was on this Nick Myers hot seat train this year. And of course it's the year that they have made this big, huge run moving over to the other big tournament of the weekend. Of course, in the ACC there's nothing really to talk about. It took place. Uh, somebody won. I don't, I don't really know what happened there. Probably not really.

[00:07:06] Worth talking about. Just kidding. Syracuse beat Duke in the ACC championship. It was a very good game. Uh, I am not too bitter about it. I tweeted out after the game and I definitely meant it. Syracuse deserved to win the game. They are a very good team.

[00:07:33] I have said pretty much all year that they are going to be fine through all of their ups and downs. They're going to be fine. They are going to be a team worth taking a look at, at least. I think they will make some kind of a run in the NCAA tournament. Uh, I don't have them, you know, making it all the way, but I'm not going to be wholly shocked if it does.

[00:07:58] And they, again, they deserve to win. They made the right plays at the right times and did what they needed to do. However, that being said, as a Duke fan, it was a fairly frustrating game because I felt like a lot of what prevented us from winning was self-inflicted.

[00:08:25] Um, again, I'm not trying to take anything away from Syracuse. They made the plays they needed to, to make in order to win, but the sheer number of times, especially coming down the stretch when, when that game got really tight in the last five minutes or whatever.

[00:08:44] It was so many dumb, simple things, just simple exchanges guys, not being able to throw and catch Syracuse. Isn't forcing these changes. It's literally us standing on the outside perimeter, passing the ball around and throwing it out of bounds, you know, stuff like that.

[00:09:06] That being said, uh, uh, again, another part of why I'm, I'm not too bitter about it is even with all of the shooting ourselves in the foot that we did. And yes, I say we for Duke, whatever, get off my back. Uh, even with all of the shooting ourselves in the foot that we did, we were right there at the very end of the game.

[00:09:37] I really thought that this was going to be revenge for the last time that we played Syracuse in the ACC championship game in 2016, when we were up by a goal and they scored. With, you know, three seconds left to tie it and then, uh, uh, scored the goal in overtime to win it. And I thought we were about to flip it when we got the ball back.

[00:10:05] They called that time out with, I think it was seven seconds left called the play that drove to the middle, dumped it down to the crease. And I mean, we're just, I think it was Eric Malever, uh, just a tiny flick of the wrist to, you know, pull it just a little bit. I mean, he missed, he missed that cage by, uh, to be fair, he missed it by probably a decent margin considering where he was standing on the field.

[00:10:32] But, you know, just a slight more flick of the wrist and getting it, uh, wrapped all the way around the goalie and inside that, that far post. Because we, we were not far away.

[00:10:44] So I feel fairly good about Duke, um, as frustrating as that game was to experience and to, as a, as a Duke fan to experience and see all the ways that it could have gone differently for us. If we had just done our part. Um, but again, Syracuse deserves it.

[00:11:14] They, they played a great game. It was stressful for me as a Duke fan, but I can, I can remove myself from the situation enough and see that, you know, as a neutral, it was a fun game. Uh, I, I, it had pretty much everything that you would want. Maybe, maybe you'd want a little bit more scoring, uh, you know, typically, but otherwise it was, it was a good, fun, enjoyable game.

[00:11:42] And I think both teams are going to have something to say in the national tournament. Uh, hopefully, hopefully neither of the teams just do what they have done at times this season and just don't show up.

[00:11:58] But I think, I think they've got it figured out and the last conference championship game to talk about is probably the one that had the biggest impact on the NCAA tournament. All of the talk coming in to the weekend was about army and whether or not they could still get into the tournament.

[00:12:21] If they didn't win the Patriot league championship, the prevailing thought coming in to the weekend was that it was between them and Harvard for that last spot.

[00:12:33] That pretty much everyone else in the field was a, was a lock at that point, but the kind of one final spot was between army and Harvard, but with Harvard having the better RPI and better wins with no bad losses that would kind of disqualify them.

[00:12:56] It, it, it really felt like if army didn't grab the Patriot league championship and the accompanying automatic qualifier that they were going to end up on the outside looking in. And they immediately lost in the first round of the Patriot league tournament. Colgate beat them 16 to 13 and then surprised.

[00:13:22] I think a lot of people beating Boston in the championship game 17 to 10 and earning that Patriot league automatic qualifier and leaving army on the outside looking in. There was a big discussion online, uh, from a lot of people. I w I won't even say it was a majority of people by any stretch.

[00:13:46] There was a loud, I think probably minority of people suggesting that army got snubbed. I, I don't understand that. It seems so goofy to me to think that they got snubbed. Uh, you know, to me, it, it reminds me a lot of like being a Boise state fan and, and, you know,

[00:14:12] you know, if you're a Boise state fan that your team pretty much has to go undefeated in order for you to get invited to participate in the, the, uh, college playoffs. So, uh, I think army is in that situation. I think, I think pretty much all Patriot league teams are in that.

[00:14:36] I think, I think generally the Patriot league, the America East, um, the, a son, a 10 mo most of these conferences are one bid. Leagues the, the rare exception to that for me is going to be if you're a Loyola and you play a good amount of. You have ACC and Ivy league and big 10 schools and you're out of conference schedule.

[00:15:06] And if you can win a decent amount of those games, maybe even, maybe you go undefeated in those games and then you lose the Patriot league. Championship or something, you know, army comes in and beat your Boston comes in and beat you. Colgate comes in and beat you in that championship game.

[00:15:22] I think they can in that situation turn into maybe a two bid league, but generally speaking, they don't play the schedules that allow you to lose. Uh, even, even one or two games and still really be in contention for an at large birth.

[00:15:44] There's just not that many at large, uh, spots available, especially with the ACC, not having an automatic qualifier because they don't have enough teams to qualify for an automatic qualifier. You're looking at up to five of the, I think it's eight. Uh, at large bids being from the ACC by the time you have added in the big 10 and Ivy league schools.

[00:16:11] There's basically no at large bids for anyone who's not in one of those three conferences. And truthfully, I think army knew that I think army knows that if they don't win their conference, they are unlikely to make it into the NCAA tournament. Their, their schedule just isn't good enough. So all the people saying that. They deserved to be in, of course they deserve to be in lots of teams.

[00:16:41] They deserve to be in, but it doesn't mean that you get in just because you deserve to be in. Doesn't mean that you get in. I'm a Duke fan. It happened to us in 2020 and 2022, excuse me. I think that Duke team was a team that could have. Reeled off several wins and made a deep run. They deserve to be in there, but they didn't make it. They didn't have the resume to do it.

[00:17:10] So I'm not, I'm not really one for that. That idea that army is snubbed or should have made it or anything like that. To me, that's, that's just crazy talk in Colgate. Colgate took the opportunity from army to, to be in the NCAA tournament and they did it on the field. They did it, you know, fairly. I don't, I don't think that there's any real debate. To be completely honest.

[00:17:40] I think there's, there's an argument to be had that Boston had a better chance of making it than army did. That that's up for debate. I will grant you. I'm not going to argue too hard, but, but I think there's an argument at least to be made that Boston had the better argument being snubbed than army.

[00:18:03] I think a lot of it comes down to where army is in the polls, but for me, I think that they're overranked because. Because I think that they. Started off so well up through, you know, the UNC game and several games after they were, they were undefeated. I think they were somewhere around eight. No, off the top of my head.

[00:18:28] Correct me in the comments if you know, better than that, I think they got to eight and oh, maybe even nine and oh. But a lot of that was them beating lesser teams. I mean, other than the UNC win their best win is against Yale, which is a five and 18. You know, they're terrible. I don't, I saw someone posted about an NIT tournament and lots of people were picking Yale.

[00:18:55] And I was like, based on what they're five and eight, like they're not a good team this year. So a lot of their ranking I think was inflated just because they were undefeated similar with like Fairfield at one point, you know, they were undefeated and they were climbing up the rankings. The difference between the two is that when army lost. People didn't want to drop them very far. So they didn't kind of fall out of where they were by very much.

[00:19:24] And then they want to a few more games again against not great competition. And they just kind of hovered where they were instead of dropping like they probably should have based on what their resume was. So while I can sort of understand at least the concept of the idea of like, Hey, army was at least at one point in the last week or two was, you know, a top five.

[00:19:51] Team in the country and they're not making the NCAA tournament. I can, I can understand that as a concept. And for a lot of teams, I think that would be a pretty good argument. I think that in this specific case, army just hasn't fallen in the rankings as far as they probably should have. And it's not actually reflective of where they actually are in the landscape of college lacrosse this season.

[00:20:20] The NCAA tournament officially got underway a couple of days ago with air force beating Robert Morris and Albany beating Sienna in the quote unquote play in games. So we are officially underway, but the real tournament, obviously the first round starts this weekend.

[00:20:46] I'm not going to go through every single game, but I thought I would talk about the four that are kind of the toss up games. We are obviously going to start in Columbus with Ohio State Notre Dame. That is probably the kind of headline matchup of this weekend. I know a lot of Ohio State fans are somewhat upset about drawing Notre Dame.

[00:21:13] I definitely understand that argument, why they would be upset, especially because, you know, the NCAA tournament is, I hesitate to say unique in this because obviously the NCAA basketball tournament also does do seating regionally. Uh, though they are a little bit more prone to move people across where it makes sense to.

[00:21:43] I remember Duke one year was in the Western regional. Uh, they also do weird things where like the Western regional will play in Raleigh, North Carolina. And it's like, this doesn't make any freaking sense, but they do do it to an extent. But the lacrosse tournament obviously is based pretty heavily around geography and locations.

[00:22:08] So I can, I can understand the, uh, upset nature of Ohio state fans who say, Hey, we just won the big 10 regular season championship and the big 10. Uh, uh, tournament championship and our reward for that is the two time defending national championship, Notre Dame fighting Irish. Uh, just because they are down the road from us.

[00:22:35] Meanwhile, Penn state, Maryland, all these other teams that we beat in our own conference are playing. Quote unquote lesser teams. And that's not super fair. Again, I understand that I can agree with it to an extent.

[00:23:01] The one thing that I would say in response to that is if I was Ohio state, I would feel real good about this matchup. Would I probably feel better about playing, you know, Colgate probably, but I think Notre Dame is a bit overhyped. And I also think that Ohio state matches up with them very well.

[00:23:30] I think that, and that bore itself out when Ohio state beat Notre Dame at Notre Dame earlier this year. I don't see why we would get a different result this year. Boring, you know, how state laying an egg, uh, or Notre Dame just coming out on fire.

[00:23:56] Uh, I just don't see Notre Dame having any, anything to combat what Ohio state is going to do this year. They feel, I hesitate to call them a team of destiny because I don't have them even making the final floor. But I also wouldn't be surprised if they won the whole thing.

[00:24:21] Like it there it's, it's one of those seasons where it's wide open and it feels like there are quite a few teams who could win it all. And Ohio state is one of those teams, even if I don't think they actually pull it off. But again, back to this specific matchup, I think that I, uh, again, if I was Ohio state, I would feel very good about the matchup with Notre Dame. I would, I would feel like it's a game, not just that we can win, but that we should win.

[00:24:51] We should win based on what these two teams have done on the field. This season, Ohio state should win for some reason. They are the underdog by betting lines is my understanding. I'm not a big better. I know that the line at least opened with Notre Dame, uh, being the favorite.

[00:25:13] I don't know if that has shifted at all, but, uh, I don't know why that is Ohio state. Again, based on what they have done on the field, Ohio state is the better team. Ohio state should win this game. And I don't want to say it would be a blowout by any stretch, but I, I think it would be kind of like that Maryland game where they're going to get up three, four, five goals and just kind of stay out in front.

[00:25:41] It's not going to be this like tense, close battle. Other than again, in the back of your mind is the two time defending national championships. It's Notre Dame. It's Chris Cavanaugh. It's coast coach Corrigan. It's Jake Taylor, you know, like they got some guns and in the back of your mind, I'd hope that you are, you know, that, and you're, you don't let up on anything. But again, boring that.

[00:26:10] Boring that kind of understanding that this is Notre Dame and they can make the run and we got us, you know, keep the, keep the pedal to the metal there and just keep going. Again, I think it's, I think it's, I think it's, I think it's, I think it should be relatively easy for Ohio state. Again, if I'm mapping it out, it looks a lot like that Maryland game. The next game I am looking at is UNC versus Richmond.

[00:26:37] I think this is probably the number one pick for an upset in the first round. I think so many people are high on Richmond, which is really funny because when Duke beat them, nobody was high on them. Uh, but now they are very high on Richmond and they think that this is going to be an upset. I can absolutely see it happening.

[00:27:06] I think, I think the conditions are ripe for an upset. You have a UNC team that, you know, Duke just blew the doors off of last Thursday night. That is kind of fading at the wrong time.

[00:27:23] They have some injuries in some key spots and they're going up against a talented, very put together and like well drilled Richmond team that just won its conference championship. And, you know, it has all of the, the makings of an upset. I do think I'm, I'm going to ride with North Carolina on this, on this round again.

[00:27:53] I'm not going to be super surprised to see Richmond. Uh, I I'm not even going to say I'm super surprised. I'm not going to be surprised if Richmond wins this game. They, again, they are a good, well-drilled team and UNC again is kind of fading and I think it, it can happen.

[00:28:13] But ultimately I just think that UNC has the weapons that will cause Richmond problems and a defense that will do enough to kind of hold Richmond at bay. And I think UNC does just enough to win this game and move on to the next round. Uh, you'll know at, at one point I had them in, in my final four.

[00:28:43] I don't anymore. Um, but I do think they get out of the first round and get past Richmond. I do think that they make it out of this first round. They get past Richmond. They, they, they ultimately win the game. I don't know that it's going to be by a huge margin. I think, I think it goes one of two ways.

[00:29:06] They blow the doors off of Richmond and you know, Dom and Owen Duffy go for, you know, 10 points. And 10 goals, I guess I should say. And they, they just run out the way that they were kind of doing earlier in the year. And they just run out to this big, huge victory, or it's going to be crazy tight. Maybe even kind of like an overtime kind of game.

[00:29:31] I think it goes one of those two ways, but either way, I think, I think UNC does just enough. Uh, to win and they are rewarded by having to face Cornell in the next round. So congrats UNC. Uh, the third game that is on this list. It's, it's pretty much those kind of middle, uh, bracket games is Duke Georgetown.

[00:29:59] I am obviously a Homer and I really, really hate to make any projections when it's my team. I, I really actually hate it. I'm actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I'm like, oh man, should I just not give you guys a prediction? But I will, I will be a person of honor and I will go ahead and, and, and give you guys what I had been thinking.

[00:30:28] And I think I like this Georgetown team a lot. I love Aiden Carroll. I like, uh, some of the weapons that they have. I think that they are a good team, but I think that Duke matches up really well with them. I think that the things that Duke is good at are the things that Georgetown is bad at. Uh, I don't, and I don't know that the things that Georgetown is good at.

[00:30:58] Meet up as well with the things that Duke is good at. Like Georgetown's offense is good. It's the strong point of that team, but I don't think it's strong enough to overcome. Um, what has is, as I have said to you guys all year is a very good defense from Duke. And, uh, I think they showed that this week.

[00:31:21] Uh, I think really all eyes were kind of on Duke in that ACC tournament and people really got to see how good this defense is. And can be, they can once in a while fall asleep a little bit, but it typically takes a very, very good offense to do that. Well, like, like a Cornell or a Princeton or something like that.

[00:31:44] It takes, it takes a very good offense to really expose Duke and not many teams have that. And I don't think Georgetown has that either. And I don't think that they have the defense that can keep Duke down either. Uh, one of the things that I really like about this Duke offense is how well they, they share the ball.

[00:32:09] Uh, I have said, I have been tracking throughout the season. I've mentioned it several times on the show, but. Uh, at this point Duke has, I'm pretty sure it is six, five or more goal games from it.

[00:32:29] Like individual players who have had five or more goals in a game, the starting six, five, have those six. Five point games. And the one player who doesn't have one is Andrew McAdory, who just went number two to the California Redwoods in the PLL draft. So when you look at that, you think, okay. Okay.

[00:32:55] While obviously Andrew McAdory is kind of the focal point, they can, all of the guys on that team can beat you. And I don't know that Georgetown has the ability to stop all of them. The ways that teams who, who kind of can't do it on both ends have stopped them are at face-offs and riding and preventing Duke does not clear super well. They, they can, they've had a hundred percent games even, but.

[00:33:25] If you can, if they don't do it super well, and if you can slow them down on the clear and cause a lot of problems for Duke. And again, I, I just don't think that Georgetown. Does either of those things at a, at a good enough clip that it's actually going to cause Duke problems. So I don't expect this to be a huge margin of victory for Duke.

[00:33:48] I would say less than four goals for Duke, but I think Duke is going to win this game. The one risk that you run with Duke all this year is that they just flat out. Don't show up. Uh, it it's happened before. Uh, obviously they laid an absolute stinker in Denver.

[00:34:14] Um, I would like to think that some travel and some of that was, was related. I don't, I don't know. I didn't get to watch that game cause it was on, you know, flow sports or whatever. So I would like to think that was the case. It played at least some part in it that won't be present in a game like this. They are the home team. It will be at Koskinen stadium in Durham. So.

[00:34:40] I think that they can, you know, make the moves and make this game happen. But again, like I've said, you always run the risk with this Duke team of them, just not even getting off the bus. I don't know if they overlook Georgetown or what, but that's always a possibility, but I think they do get it done. I, uh, I hate to do this, but I am picking Duke.

[00:35:04] Uh, for anyone who doesn't know, I am insanely superstitious about my teams. Uh, especially Duke and Manchester United are like my two big teams and I am insanely neurotic about them. Uh, I, if a game has already started, I don't turn it on. Um, I just try and track it through other means.

[00:35:32] Uh, I try to kind of take my mind off of it. Uh, so I don't watch a game that's already started. I never pick my own teams, which is why I'm probably, I've probably just jinxed myself here and Georgetown will win this game. I'd never like as a rule. I just don't pick my game. I completely abstain from picking a game that Duke is involved in, or, you know, Manchester United, not that many people do pick them in soccer like that, but. I just, I just don't do it.

[00:36:02] And I am a little shocked guy. I just did it, but I wrote it and wasn't really thinking about it until I started talking. So let's move on to the fourth game and that is obviously Cuse and Harvard. This is going to be, I think a really fun game to watch. I think these two teams match up really well. I think this should be a super fun game to watch.

[00:36:32] They met earlier in the dome and Harvard actually won 15 to 14. It was a very fast, fun offensive game. I would expect the same sort of game, a fast, fun, offensive game. My hope would be that we get a little bit more out of Sam King, but I also pretty sure

[00:36:55] that Syracuse is going to probably key a bit on him and try to take him out of the game. That being said, I think Syracuse probably wins this, this time around. They obviously barely lost. It was, it was a one point game, 15, 14.

[00:37:20] They had great, great stuff from Finn Thompson and Owen Hiltz and even, even Joey Spelina. The three of them combined for 16 points in the last, in the game earlier this season. And I think that they are probably going to do something like that again. I think they're going to be on a little bit of a roll and it should. I think again, it's a close game. I think, I think Syracuse probably wins. I'm going to say Syracuse by two.

[00:37:50] I think a little bit closer than maybe some of the, the other games obviously do UNC road trend I said could be a one goal game, but I think, I think you're looking at about a two goal game here with Syracuse coming out. I think it being in the dome and them coming off of the ACC championship and trying to, you know, get back to, you know, national relevance for the first time since they made the final

[00:38:16] four in 2013 over a decade ago, uh, is definitely going to be playing on their mind and hopefully driving them forward. That being said, hard is great team. Again, they've already beat them once. It's not out of the realm of possibility to see them. It could also be one of those things where not having been, you know, nationally relevant

[00:38:42] when it comes to the NCAA tournament since 2013 starts to play on them guys overthink it. It could backfire could go the other way. I just, I just don't think it does. Uh, this, this year they're too good. That offense is so smooth. Uh, the, I guess the one caveat to that is it's a Jerry burn team and that dude can coach

[00:39:08] some defense, uh, not that the 1514 game necessarily was the best, uh, indicator of that, but he is going to game plan for that offense. And I, I not going to be wholly shocked again, if we see a Harvard win, but the Harvard win was at the beginning of the season was the first time they'd ever beat Syracuse. I believe it was the first time they'd ever beat them period.

[00:39:37] Uh, but it was definitely the first time they had beat them in the dome. Um, so yeah, I, I, I think Syracuse is going to want that lick back and they are going to push for the victory and come out with, uh, moving on to the next round where they will face probably Princeton.

[00:40:02] So that will be a really fun matchup, assuming that Princeton beats Towson, which I personally have, but, uh, don't want to look too far ahead. Cause the Harvard is going to be a tough team for them. Looking ahead to the end of the tournament, I picked this final four out about week three or four. And I just, I haven't had any reason to change them again.

[00:40:31] I think I did change UNC to Penn state at one point, but barring that I haven't really had any reason to change these teams. Uh, that is Cornell, Maryland, Princeton, and Penn state. Uh, I, I think those four, I think there's probably seven ish teams. If you consider those four, uh, Ohio state Duke and Syracuse.

[00:40:58] I think those are the, any kind of combination of those eight teams is not going to be very shocking. You could probably even throw Notre Dame in that again, they're a two-time national champion. Uh, I think, I don't think they make it, but if they do, you're not going to be like, Oh, where did this come from?

[00:41:19] So, so those seven or eight teams, if you want to include Notre Dame, I think are the real, you know, teams that are in consideration for this final four. But like I said, I've, I picked, I picked my four weeks and weeks ago, and I just haven't felt the need to change them. The one probably note of contention there. Well, let's say there's two.

[00:41:47] I think most people probably have Cornell. And I think most people probably have Maryland. Both have fairly good, uh, pathways to the final four with Cornell needing to beat Albany. And then, you know, the winner of North Carolina, Richmond, you feel pretty good about that.

[00:42:11] Maryland will have to beat probably Duke, you know, at least in terms of chalk winning out. It could be Georgetown, uh, but probably Duke. Uh, and that is not going to be an easy feat. I hope it is not an easy feat, but ultimately I think most people probably think Maryland wins that game.

[00:42:36] The two bones of contention are probably Syracuse, uh, and Princeton on one side and Penn state versus Ohio state on the other side. I'm kind of riding with the guys. I'm not too terribly, uh, I'm riding with the guys that I picked. I'm not too terribly, uh, bothered. If you think Syracuse and or Ohio state is going to win those.

[00:43:03] I think when it comes to Penn state, Ohio state, Ohio state beat Penn state earlier this year, but Penn state was dealing with, uh, some injuries and guys, uh, some of their very important players, guys like, um, what I just totally blank.

[00:43:23] I think on his name, Matt trainer, uh, Jack, a, a among a, a money, uh, both had been out for several weeks with injuries and came back for that game. I don't know that they were 100%. And even if they were, uh, they were working their way back in. I don't know that that game plays out the way that it did then. If we played it again today, I think both teams are better than they were.

[00:43:51] And I think Penn state again was, was missing some of their very, very key players. And, uh, so again, I'm not bothered if you think Ohio state would be Penn state. It's not, that's kind of a toss up for me. I'm, I'm riding with Penn state because I picked Penn state all year. I haven't, I haven't seen anything from them that makes me think they can't win that game.

[00:44:16] Um, similarly with Princeton and Syracuse. I'm not too bothered. If you think Syracuse would win that game, they're certainly good enough. Uh, I do think Princeton where I think this game is less of a toss up than the Penn state, Ohio state game. Uh, not so much again, that I'm bothered. If you think Syracuse wins it.

[00:44:41] Um, I just think that Princeton has so much freaking firepower. Uh, you know, for, for three and a half quarters of that Cornell game, uh, in the Ivy league championship this weekend, it looked like they were just gonna cruise to a victory. Uh, and then, then they, then they let Cornell back into it a little bit.

[00:45:05] And then there was that insane two minute penalty and that just seemed to like crushed her spirits. So, uh, again, I I'm riding with Princeton cause I have, cause I, I picked them, you know, at the beginning of the season. And I just don't see a need to change them. Uh, I, I think they can beat this Syracuse team.

[00:45:29] I think they, I think they will beat the Syracuse team, but again, it's not by so much that I think that I'm like, oh, what, what are you talking about? You know, if you came to me and said, North Carolina was going to beat Cornell, I'd, I'd be like, oh, I don't know about that one. Uh, but you say Syracuse is going to be Princeton and I'll say, I mean, I can see it. There's definitely, definitely a case to be made there, but that is my final four.

[00:45:57] I haven't really thought too much about it. Uh, right here on the fly. Uh, I can, I can try to go a little bit farther. Um, but I, I haven't given this too much thought. So I will tell you that if I do this right here, right now, live come next week, I might have changed my mind. Uh, but I'll let you know. So let's, let's see here. Princeton would play Maryland.

[00:46:25] Wait, is that even, I hate the way they do this. I think it's Princeton would play Maryland and Cornell would play Penn state. I think Cornell beats Penn state. I think Maryland beats Princeton. Maybe.

[00:46:46] Uh, which would give us a Cornell Maryland final and Maryland. I think, I don't know. It's hard for me to do this live because I've kind of been down on Cornell. I, I think they're beatable, but they also just don't lose. So it's hard. It's hard to really know.

[00:47:14] Maybe, uh, again, maybe, maybe we get past this, uh, Cornell Albany game this weekend and I can give you guys a better answer for that. I, I wasn't planning to go all the way through to the championship, but sitting here, it just felt like something to do. So the, yeah, we'll, we'll say Maryland right now, but I do reserve the right to change my mind.

[00:47:39] I know that's not really how NCAA brackets work, but I haven't actually like sat down and tried to do one. So right here, right now, Maryland 2025 NCAA men's lacrosse champion. As fun as conference championship weekend was.

[00:48:01] And the transition from that into the start of the NCAA tournament, probably my favorite event of the year so far happened Tuesday night with the PLL draft happening. Uh, it was, I have always enjoyed the, the PLL draft. It's a lot of fun. There's good content, but something about this year was a little bit different.

[00:48:30] Uh, it felt like we had more coverage than we normally have had in years past. Uh, I really got kind of swept up in the, especially the day of it was, it was clearly not the NFL draft, but it was. Kind of like that. I even tweeted out like, is, is this what NFL fans feel like? Uh, sort of tongue in cheek.

[00:49:00] Uh, it's hard to be an American and not be a, an NFL fan, but I have really kind of fallen out with my NFL fan. I'm just not a, I just don't follow it. Like I did when I was a kid. Um, it's not at all like my, my favorite thing anymore. Uh, but yeah, there was something about Tuesday and, and just the coverage that was coming in all day.

[00:49:25] And, uh, I don't know how many of you guys watched it, but we have been asking for pre and post game shows. And, uh, Kevin Bolin, I think that's how you say his name. Apologies, Kevin, if that's not. Uh, Kevin and Alex pool, who together kind of run TLN, they ran a pre and post draft show. It was a studio show live in the ESPN studio. They interviewed, uh, several of the coaches.

[00:49:54] Uh, I think they did two in the, in the pre show and two in the post show. Uh, it was really fun and really kind of like added to the atmosphere of, uh, kind of leading up to the, the, uh, trade. And then there was, or that to the draft, sorry, that's why I was stumbling over my words.

[00:50:15] Um, and then like Dan arestia was live Instagramming, uh, from ESPN all day. Kyle Bennett of the outside the box, uh, lacrosse podcast was also at ESPN in Connecticut for the draft providing coverage throughout the day. There were rumors kind of swirling all day about potential trades and things that could be happening, what this team might be looking for. I don't know.

[00:50:44] There was just something about it that was really fun in ways that I don't think it has been in previous years. And I got really kind of swept up in the day of it. Uh, did help. I did. Uh, like I said, Kyle from, uh, outside the box was.

[00:51:04] Uh, at ESPN covering the event live and asked me and several other, uh, podcasters to jump on their live feed. They did a live feed during the, uh, draft and please go check that out. If you haven't, it was a lot of fun. I think we were on there for three and a half hours or something like that. Uh, but it was, it was a really good time.

[00:51:30] That also certainly helped, uh, being there talking, you know, live with other fans who were watching it was, was super fun. It's usually, I think in years past has been something I've done on my own, just watched it by myself. And, you know, maybe tweeted or something about it with, with fans that way. Uh, I know, uh, Scotty and the sticklax boys were, uh, also live during the draft.

[00:51:58] And then they did a podcast immediately after that was a lot of fun hearing them talking to them. It was also really funny because Scotty was running his live show and then he was in the OTB chat, texting us and stuff. So, uh, I don't know. It was, it was a good time and I really, really enjoyed it. Please go check out the everyone's content. Everyone that I just mentioned was doing good stuff.

[00:52:25] Uh, it was really fun to be a part of even in a, in a small way, but yeah, it was, it just felt bigger this year for some reason. And I don't know why exactly, but it did and I really, really enjoyed it, but let's talk about the draft itself. The water dogs in probably the most obvious move of all time took CJ curse.

[00:52:54] Duh, of course they did the all time leading goal scorer in, in C to play history. And is almost a lock to win the Tauraton and is probably the favorite to lead his team to a title in a few weeks time. Like, of course he was the number one pick. There was no one else. There was no one else that should have even been considered.

[00:53:18] I, if you know, I think CJ has been the projected number one for, for three, like since he was a freshman at Cornell. So I'm pretty sure that the second it was determined that the water dogs had the number one pick bill Tierney already knew CJ cursed. I think the woods would have known it was CJ. I didn't matter who it was. CJ was that number one pick. I think, I think it could have been the Atlas and they, it would have been CJ curse. They'd have figured it out.

[00:53:46] But CJ curses is that, that kind of guy that he was going, he was always going to be number one. The rest of the water dogs picks have some version of an asterisk for me. They, they got studs. Don't get me wrong. Like it's not a hate thing. I just have thoughts. Um, we'll, we'll look at two.

[00:54:13] We'll, we'll look at a third one later, but, uh, we'll start with Jake Taylor. I don't know where he fits on this roster. The attack line for them is so deep. They have CJ cursed, obviously. Kieran McArdle, Mike, Michael Sowers. That is probably your day one of camp starting attack line.

[00:54:39] The only caveat to that might be if CJ is playing for national championship and isn't there, but at least day one of CJ being there, that is probably your starting attack. Then they have. Well, Zed's injured, but next year he probably, that's probably your starting attack. You'd sweep, you switch Kieran McArdle for Zed Williams run Zed, Michael Sowers and, uh, CJ.

[00:55:09] But then even beyond that, you have Ethan Walker and Michael Boehm, Bane, Boehm from Michigan. And then you have Jake Taylor. I don't know where he fits in this attack line. Again, we go back to day one and I think he probably slides in behind Ethan Walker on a, on a depth chart. He's he's the fifth or sixth guy.

[00:55:37] Now he may come in and blow everyone away in camp and, and slide up a spot or two, but it still feels like. That starting attack is going to be Michael Sowers, CJ cursed and Karen McArdle. And then the next issue becomes, I don't think that Jake Taylor's skillset comes out of the box very well.

[00:55:59] The one, the one way it could maybe work is that you run him a little bit like CJ cursed in that, that kind of old school two, three, one or one, three, two. If you're one of those weirdos that counts from attack to midfield. That's weird, but whatever, uh, either way, the old school, like two triangles kind of offense where one of your midfielders goes to the crease.

[00:56:24] That's what Jake Taylor's like game is, is being in and around the crease being more of a finisher. I'm not saying he can't dodge. I don't think it's his strong suit and he's going to go up a level here. I don't think it's a strong suit at Notre Dame and he's going up a level. So the, the one kind of way it could, it could maybe work is that you run him out of the box and just kind of use him as like that Westberg kind of. You know, in and around the crease kind of guy.

[00:56:53] That's probably the, the best fit, especially when you look at this midfield unit of Zachary, a Jack Hannah, Connor Kelly, Thomas McComby and Mikey Schlosser. That's it. They, they only have those five guys. So it makes a lot of sense for him. Other than again, the fact that you, you aren't getting a lot of midfield help from, from him.

[00:57:20] That's not necessarily a bad thing in the PLL. I think, I think the PLL does work a little bit more, kind of more like offense defense. Uh, you know, you have your offensive midfielders and your defensive midfielders, and then obviously attackmen and pulls. Um, and, and so you're not, you're, you're more concerned with just getting guys on to play offense.

[00:57:46] But I still feel like you have to game plan around Jake Taylor's skillset specifically, uh, in a way that you don't have to with a lot of guys. So, so again, all that to say, I'm, I'm just a little bit confused about the pick for him. Not because I have any issue with Jake Taylor, but just because I don't know that I see the fit. That being said, Bill Tierney is a way better coach than I will ever be.

[00:58:15] He, he can maybe figure it out in a way that I can't, but whatever. The other player that I have an asterisk around for me is Dylan Hess. And again, has nothing to do with him as a player. Seems like he is going to be a stud and worth every cent they spend on him. My, my issue has more to do with him even being in this draft.

[00:58:45] For those of you that, that don't know that, that don't know the story of Dylan Hess. He was at Georgetown for four years. He, he played at Georgetown and was drafted last year by the Carolina chaos in the fourth round. But chose to go to the university of Florida this year and use a year of eligibility, trying to play football. But he did not make the football team.

[00:59:12] And while still enrolled in the school decided might as well play MCLA. The PLL ruled that because he went back to school and played lacrosse, he had to reenter the draft. And obviously was then picked up by the water dogs in the second round.

[00:59:33] And I don't know, again, we talked about the, the, the TLN pre and post game show, uh, post draft show during the post draft show. They interviewed, uh, Spencer Ford of the Carolina chaos. And they asked him about Dylan has, and he seemed to be both surprised that Dylan has was available in this draft.

[01:00:01] And fairly annoyed that Dylan has was not a Carolina chaos player. And when I brought it up, the response I got back was he went to school to play lacrosse and they compared him. Uh, Dan said he's less Cole Kastner who went to go play. Cause that let's start there.

[01:00:27] The rule is if you go back to school and you play a sport other than lacrosse, you, your rights are retained for two years. So Cole Kastner was drafted by the Redwoods last year, went to Stanford to play basketball and will play with the California Redwoods this year. That is different than going back to school and playing lacrosse.

[01:00:53] The, the example there is Levi Anderson, who, if I remember correctly, was drafted, I think in 2022 decided to go back to school to play lacrosse. He, I think he used a COVID year or something, went back to school, played lacrosse and was redrafted the next year in 2023 or whenever it was. My issue with Dylan Hess though, is he didn't go back to school to play lacrosse.

[01:01:21] He went to school to play football. When he didn't make the team, he decided might as well keep sticking my hand and enrolled with the MCLA club team at the university of Florida. Overall, I have an issue with using club ball in the same way that we're using NCAA ball.

[01:01:47] Uh, no one is choosing to further their lacrosse career by no one is going is. No one is choosing to further their lacrosse career by going to a school to play club lacrosse. Like that's not the decision-making process.

[01:02:09] It is very different from the Levi Anderson situation of going back to school, taking an, an extra year of NCAA, uh, eligibility and playing NCAA lacrosse. In Levi Anderson's case, if I remember correctly with the team that he had been playing with already. He just took an, an, an, that again, I think it was a COVID year.

[01:02:37] It might've been a redshirt year, but I think it was a COVID year. Took it and went back to school and played NCAA lacrosse. Dylan Hess went to Florida. The only reason he wasn't in the PLL last year was because he wanted to go play football. He went to Florida to try to play football. He didn't make the team and decided while I'm here, I'm going to go play for the club lacrosse team.

[01:03:07] By the way, by the way, shortly after he was drafted, I don't know if you guys saw, if you didn't, please check it out. He scored a great goal for Florida during the MCLA national championships that are taking place right now, uh, during this week. Uh, it was, it was a pretty good goal. I believe Florida ultimately ended up losing that game and he is at home, but back to what I was saying for me, those are very, very different situations.

[01:03:36] Like I said, no one is choosing to further their lacrosse career by going and playing club lacrosse at a school.

[01:03:43] So moreover, I don't know that this will happen, but to me, it leaves the door open for someone to decide that, you know, Allah Eli Manning, they don't want to play for team X, Y, and Z.

[01:04:08] And they're going to go enroll at an MCLA school, get a graduate degree that will help them when they're done with lacrosse. Anyway, play club and force themselves to be re-entered into the PLL draft and be redrafted by a different team. In the case of Dylan Hess, he went from being drafted in the fourth round to being drafted in the second round.

[01:04:35] I know it ain't NFL money, but there's a money difference between those two. It, again, it's probably not huge, maybe a couple of thousand dollars, maybe, but there is a money difference there. Like there's, there's a reason that you could do that.

[01:04:53] And especially in an era of NIL with MCLA, like, you know, they, when I played MCLA in the early two thousands, there were teams that ran what they, what were called virtual varsity. In fact, uh, there were, there were early social media accounts that were called virtual varsity that were MCLA, like tracking accounts. Like, um, there's one big MCLA account.

[01:05:20] I cannot even remember what I can't remember off the top of my head, what his name, but there's one, uh, large MCLA Twitter account. And, uh, basically the early version of that was one called virtual varsity and teams were able to offer, you know, light kind of scholarships to get people into the door. Uh, they could, obviously they could pay their dues and stuff. They could do that as, as like a recruiting technique.

[01:05:50] If you, you had a guy who was considering, you know, maybe a D two school where he could, he could get a little bit of something from the school. Um, it was, um, it was okay. And so the, the club teams, some of the, the bigger club teams could offer a somewhat similar package to convince them to come and play at their school. It was not super organized.

[01:06:15] It's kind of like the MSL thing where like some guys might've been getting a little bit and rest of the guys were getting nothing. But, um, it leaves the door open for abuse of that system because it is a different system, if that makes any sense.

[01:06:35] So I just don't love the idea that we're treating going back to school and playing club lacrosse the same way that we're treating going back to school to play NCAA lacrosse. And, and again, Dylan has, didn't go, didn't even go to school to play club lacrosse.

[01:07:02] He went to go play football and, and for me there, there's a very clear difference between that. And I think it's a lot closer to what Cole Kastner did than what Levi Anderson did. So those are my two kind of asterisks on some of the other water dogs picks. Like I said, I have another asterisk, but we'll get to it later.

[01:07:28] As for the rest of the draft, I think most of the teams did pretty well. I think most of them looked at the holes in their roster and addressed the specific holes in their roster pretty well. Generally we can argue over a pick here or there, but generally I think they did pretty well.

[01:07:52] I'd say that archers, Atlas cannons and outlaws all did very well in, in seeing the gaps in their rosters and filling them with really, really solid picks. The outlaws did not in fact pick three attack men as one of the TLN mock drafts right before the draft had mocked up.

[01:08:18] Uh, Colter Mackesy might be the best fit with his team of any draft pick, like literally bar none. He might be the best kind of like this dude is going to plug right in and do everything they need him to do. I would probably have him.

[01:08:45] Yeah, I'd probably have him as a, as a high candidate for rookie of the year right now today. Um, and then probably my, my favorite pick from the draft is Matt trainer going to the Atlas. I love Matt trailer, Matt trainers game. And I think adding him to that offense is going to be crazy.

[01:09:13] Uh, cause the flexibility he gives them, you know, Connor Schellenberger had some injuries last year. The, the ability to fill in, uh, on attack, to run out of the box, to play. I, I don't think that he plays the same. I don't think he's Jeff T or anything, but sometimes I watch him and I feel like him and Jeff T see the game very similarly, similarly.

[01:09:41] And I think he could be another kind of Zander Dixon in a, in a slightly different way, but, uh, another kind of guy that just like clicks with Jeff T and I mean, let's be real. I think that he could be a guy that comes in and just immediately clicks.

[01:10:09] And I don't know, I really, really like that, that draft pick for the Atlas. But again, if I'm one of those four teams, I'm feeling pretty good about my draft. So well done for them. Um, another big story from the draft was falling players. Uh, I know that's obviously a, a.

[01:10:33] Story in every draft is, is kind of who slides and, and falls out of, you know, rounds and stuff that they were projected to go in. But this is the first year where I remember several big names sliding kind of all at once last year, there was obviously TJ Malone where, you know, so many of us who had watched TJ play over the year. We're like, what is happening?

[01:10:58] Why are we getting into the third round and TJ Malone hasn't been picked up, but this is the first year where there were three or four guys that you were expecting to be kind of. Early second round that we're like rounding down into the third and fourth round before they're getting picked. And it's like, what in the world is happening? Probably the biggest name that, that took any kind of real slide is Chris Cavanaugh.

[01:11:27] I will start this out by saying. I am, you know, a Chris Cavanaugh hater. I don't actually hate him. I think he's a good player. I think he will do good things in the PLL, but. I. I put it this way on the outside the box podcast during the draft.

[01:11:51] For me, Matt Cavanaugh is the best Cavanaugh brother, like by a, by a pretty decent amount. I think Matt Cavanaugh is the best Cavanaugh brother. And in the grand scheme of PLL careers, we're ranking them split in the hairs of ranking PLL careers. I don't think Matt Cavanaugh's career has been crazy good.

[01:12:19] I, he had some good years with Denver, stuff like that. But, but overall, over the course of the entire breadth of his now complete career after he retired. Uh, last week or the week before. I don't think that you would put him on the level of some of his contemporaries. Um, and, and again, that's, that's not hate. I, I, I really liked Matt Cavanaugh to be completely honest. Um, but.

[01:12:48] So I'm not trying to hate on him in any way. Again, we're talking about splitting hairs of like all pro careers, but all that to say. Matt Cavanaugh is far and away the best. And he isn't like, you know, Jeff T caliber player.

[01:13:11] And I think a lot of people think that Pat and Chris are going to be like Jeff T cap, maybe not quite Jeff T, but are going to be up there. And I don't think they're going to even be Matt Cavanaugh. So all that to say. Everything that I am about to say, take with some, some grain of salt, knowing that I have at least somewhat of a.

[01:13:37] bias against Chris Cavanaugh and Pat Cavanaugh for that matter. But. Pat slide last year and Chris. Kavanaugh slide this year. They're not surprises to me. Cause I don't, I don't think their game translates super well to the PLL. A lot of it is built on grit and toughness and like riding hard and just working people. And.

[01:14:06] Not that that's not. A good value in the PLL. I just don't think it can be like. Your, your main contribution. If that makes any sense. Like. Writer Garnsey has a lot of those same elements, but he's also one of the most creative players in the game.

[01:14:29] I don't know that you would say that about either of the Cavanaugh's not that they aren't creative players, not that they can't do creative things. I just don't think they're on that. That same level. We'll see. I will be more than happy to be wrong. About all of this. Because if the calves turn out to be, you know, Mount Rushmore level players.

[01:14:54] I'm happy that I was wrong because I like them as people. I think they are good for the game and I think they deserve it. I just don't think that their game translates. So. All that to say, I, I think that their slide was. Kind of predictable. And you have people suggesting. Dug's online was saying, uh, that.

[01:15:21] Chris Cavanaugh was the Shador Sanders of this draft. And I'm like, he slid like five places. Like he's not the Shador Sanders. Like he, he slid a handful of places. There are other guys that we'll talk about that slid way, way longer and farther down the draft. Then Chris Cavanaugh did.

[01:15:47] And Chris Cavanaugh is still going to go in and probably be a starter or close to it. He will be an important player. Like, come on. It's, it is not the same thing. The first, the very next person that I would talk about is Sam King.

[01:16:07] Sam King, I think probably should have been a top six or seven pick and somehow went in the third round. Uh, it didn't make any sense to me. We'll get into some places that I think probably could have, and maybe should have taken him.

[01:16:29] I am absolutely blown away at the fact that he fell all the way to the third round. Uh, that being said, adding him to that archers team is nuts. Nuts. Like, I think, I think he, you can kind of eye him as a long-term replacement for a guy like Connor fields.

[01:16:59] Who's starting to get up there a little bit in age. I think he can be that long-term replacement. And in the meantime, he can be kind of maybe that maybe a fourth attack men, uh, who get some time down low, but also is running out of the box. I think he will be good for you. Uh, especially, you know, Tom Schreiber has, has had seasons cut short, uh, in each of the last, I think two seasons.

[01:17:27] He he's had, uh, an injury late in the season. Um, to the point where they moved Grant Amon into the midfield. Uh, which again, I know we've talked about this before. He does not get nearly enough credit for that. That is not as easy. We, this is a thing that I, I want to say about this draft as a whole.

[01:17:50] I think that we talk about attack men moving to midfield way too much. We, we just kind of assume that because you're an attack man, you could run out of the box and it would be totally fine. They are very different positions.

[01:18:08] They have very different skill sets and I don't think that we give enough attention to how difficult it is to make that transition. And Grant Amon should be getting a lot more credit for what he's doing in the midfield, uh, as, as an attack man. Yeah, he is an attack man.

[01:18:37] Uh, and that move has paid huge dividends because of his ability to make the move. There's, there's midfielders who can't even like have their role changed in midfield, uh, and still be playing in the midfield, but just in a different kind of role or position on the field. People can't even do that.

[01:19:04] And this dude moved anyway, side sidetracked, but Sam King, I think is one of the guys that, that could potentially move around. I, I really, I really like Sam King's pick a game. And I think that the archers landing him is going to be absolutely crazy. Uh, another guy who slid way, way down.

[01:19:31] That just didn't make any sense was Ben Weyer. He went in the third round. He actually went after Sam King. He was another guy that was projected to be high in the first round. I think there was probably some expected slip a little bit, just because some of the teams that were high, didn't really need a defensive player. But he had that high first round level of talent.

[01:19:58] It did come out that there were some concerns about his ability to defend one-on-one, but. I thought that was so goofy. And I, and I know, uh, Adam Lamberti wrote about this in his pieces. Uh, he is the, uh, writer for the PLL kind of as a whole. He's the one that does the big boards and does a lot of like the evaluating of talent. And he said exactly what I thought, which is. That.

[01:20:28] As an LSM Ben Weyer's ability. One-on-one. Is not. Necessarily the most important thing in the PLL. Uh, I think you're the LMSMS tend to be, and everyone can play it a slightly different, but. If you think of. The better LMSMS in the league. One-on-one defending is less.

[01:20:57] Is probably one of the least important skills of. An LSM in the PLL. Uh, I think, I think being able to defend as part of the unit, knowing when to slide, when not to slide doing those kinds of things. That is more important. I think. Um, and then obviously. Obviously causing turnovers and then.

[01:21:21] Picking up ground balls and pushing in transition tends to be a much, much higher thing. If you think about. Ethan roll two years ago, last year with Jake Pesino and Tyler Carpenter. Uh, most of the. Best. Big name. Kind of LSM guys that have come into the league. They are known. For those things for. For yes. Playing defense as part of a unit. But being the one to slide.

[01:21:51] To cause turnovers. To pick up ground balls. To push in transition. And especially. Uh, if, if you can. Create. Points. Whether that's through scoring or assisting. Uh, that is. That's huge. Huge. Huge. Uh, LSM's in the PLL. And that is. Ben Weyer's game. Yes. Probably not the best one-on-one defender. But. Between the lines.

[01:22:21] Pushing the ball, all that stuff. That has been where to a tee. And. You would have thought. Especially again, watching. Tyler Carpenter last year. For the Atlas. Just. Take over games. Just be everywhere and pushing the ball in transition. Scoring points. Uh, assisting, getting the ball into that offense's hands. He was the LSM of the year.

[01:22:50] By, I think a pretty decent margin. And then again, probably number two on that list was probably Ethan raw and, and Jake Pesino. Both of which again, do those same sort of things. So. Ben Weyer sliding was. So, so bizarre. And then, and then the last one for me was Ben Ramsey. Who fell all the way to the end of the fourth round. Uh, he was.

[01:23:21] Big boards are big boards. They're not, you know, gospel or anything, but it's just so weird to me that he was the number one. Uh, short stick defensive midi on just about every big board that I saw. Uh, they had him going in, in every kind of mock draft. I saw he was always. Oops. He was always the first short stick defensive midfielder off the board. And he ended up being the fourth.

[01:23:51] To be taken. Uh, Dylan has. Um, lots of people liked, and again, he was drafted last year. So. Not necessarily a huge thing for him to go after him, but like. He, he went one pick after Jack gray from Duke and I'm a Duke guy. And even I wouldn't have taken Jack gray over Ben Ramsey. So. It was just, it was confusing. Not so much that he went.

[01:24:20] You know, in the fourth round, I think. Uh, there wasn't really a high demand on short stick defensive middies in this particular draft. And I, and I don't know that any of them, you know, there, there's not necessarily.

[01:24:39] Uh, or at least there doesn't project to be, you know, kind of a, a Ryan Tara Finko or, you know, any of the, the, the kind of the big, really good short stick defensive midfielders. Uh, out there, I think there are, there's definitely some pros. There's definitely some guys that will play for awhile, but I don't know that any of these guys are necessarily. That. Kind of next level guy. We'll see what happens, but. They, they didn't go very high.

[01:25:08] Uh, in the first place. So. It's not so much that he went in. Uh, the fourth round. It's that he was the fourth one taken when he was. By pretty much every account, the best one in this draft. I don't know. It just, it felt weird and just kind of added to the storyline of like. Several of these players that it's like, what, what is happening?

[01:25:33] And again, that's, it's the first time that I can really remember seeing. Not just one, maybe two guys, but again, three, four, maybe even five guys that are just like. Plummeting down the draft. So that was definitely a story as for winners and losers in this draft. I mean, you'd be a fool to pick anyone other than the California red woods as your winner.

[01:26:03] I mean, they absolutely racked up in this draft. Uh, number two, they took Andrew McAdory. I think that was. S everyone knew CJ cursed was going number one. And then I think pretty much everyone knew that. Andrew McAdory was going to be drafted by the red woods in that, in the two, three spot. Uh, if you're watching this and you did or listening to this and you didn't.

[01:26:32] Uh, keep up with the draft. The California red woods had the second and third pick. And it was pretty much an open secret that Andrew McAdory was going to be picked. I don't know why I had this feeling that he was going to go third, that they were going to pick. Uh, whoever they picked, whoever was the other pick involved was going to go first. And Andrew McAdory was going to go third.

[01:27:01] He did end up going second for the sake of a trivia question. When that comes up, not that it matters in the grand scheme of things when they had two and three. Um, but he did go to Joe Spelina, the GM of the California red woods coached Andrew McAdory when he was, uh, in high school and a youth player. He knows him very well.

[01:27:27] Not only did Andrew McAdory project to be, you know, one of, if not the best midfielder in this class and, uh, you know, a, a very high first round draft pick. But he did have the established relationship with Joe Spelina.

[01:27:48] And I think people that know Andrew McAdory expect that he is going to be an even better pro that, that his game translates even better into the PLL than it does at the, uh, college level. So again, not, not too much of a shock there with the third pick. They picked Sam English from Syracuse. Sam English is.

[01:28:21] I sometimes I think we call a lot of guys, two way guys that are really offensive guys that, that you just basically don't. You don't get too nervous about playing defense. They're not really two way guys. They're, they're just. Offensive players that you don't. Want to immediately yank off the field. If they get stuck on defense.

[01:28:47] Um, Sam English is not that Sam English. Is a do it all midfielder to be fair. Uh, they say the same about Andrew McAdory. I gotta say as a Duke guy, I don't know that I've ever really seen Andrew McAdory play. Uh, defense, but. A lot. I read several draft profiles from. Multiple people.

[01:29:15] People that weren't more affiliated with the league. People that are people that are, you know, doing it independently, all kinds of them. And people. Mentioned that Andrew McAdory can play defense. Again, I'm a Duke guy. I haven't seen it. At least not that I'm aware of if he was a freshman and I just didn't really know who he was and he was playing some defense. Uh, then, you know, maybe that's a thing, but. I've never really known him to, but it was brought up that he could. So in that sense, Andrew McAdory could be a two way player.

[01:29:45] Sam English is that dude. Um, I have. Mentioned several times that the player comp for Sam English is Zach Curry. Uh, I don't want that to be a burden of expectation. I'm not suggesting that he will be. Zach Curry a that he he's that. Level of player. I hope he is like, I genuinely hope he is. Every bit as good as Zach Curry.

[01:30:15] But I don't mean it in that sense. I just mean it that hit that that's the kind of. You know, unicorn player that like he put, he plays on the wings. He can face off. He plays defense. He plays offense, ground balls, shooting assists. He, he does everything. So, uh, again, I hope that that is not a, a burden of expectation placed on Sam English.

[01:30:40] Um, it's just the way that I describe his game again, as, as that kind of unicorn player. So already the, the redwoods are off to a huge. When just getting those, those two alone is already a very, very good draft. This Carolina redwoods team, Carolina, California redwoods team, excuse me.

[01:31:09] The, their offense was bad, bad. And at least on paper, it has technically probably gotten a little bit worse. They've lost. RB three. I don't care what you think of that dude. RP three is one of probably the top five best professional lacrosse players ever.

[01:31:38] Professional or lacrosse players, whatever. So losing him is going to do some stuff to your offense, but. Uh, Andrew McAdory and Sam English already like slot right in and instantly make them a lot better. And then through some insane. Dumb luck.

[01:32:04] When their second round, uh, pick comes up, Chris Cavanaugh is still sitting there waiting to be selected. So of course they took him. So in the, in the first 10 picks, they got Andrew McAdory, Sam English, and Chris Cavanaugh. Again, an insane draft. Then they pick up Carter rice. I think with, uh, Isaiah Davis Allen retiring.

[01:32:29] They brought in some guys, uh, but Carter rice will have every chance to make this roster. And I think he is a very, very good pickup. And then in the final round, they were able to grab Griffin Schultz. He may not make a roster, but if he does, he could be a really nice. Peace for them, uh, as a, as a score. Uh, it could be, I think he could play really well with some of the offensive minds that they have.

[01:32:58] Uh, if he can, again, it's going to be a little bit tough for him to make a roster. Cause cause this team is packed now. Um, but if he does make it, it's, it could be really a lot of fun. But like I said, this, this offense was bad last year.

[01:33:19] And since Joe Spelina got here, they have completely reformed this team. Again, several of these guys are not going to make the roster. You can decide who these people are, but their midfield was awful last year.

[01:33:40] It was basically Romar and, uh, Cole cursed and Nakai and Ryan Tierney here and there. They're they're midfield room right this second. And again, some of these guys won't make the roster right the second it's Ryan Augevin who was with the archers, Charlie Bertrand, Aiden D'Ninza, who they signed in the off season from Duke. He hasn't played in the PLL yet.

[01:34:06] I don't think he'll make this roster, but he could be some nice depth. Romar, Sam English. Like we talked about Ronan Jacoby, who played with the cannons last year. Uh, Cole cursed Andrew McAdory, Dylan Malloy, Nakai Montgomery, Griffin Schultz and Ryan Tierney. That. Midfield line went from.

[01:34:32] One of the shallowest to one of the deepest overnight. Uh, they could still potentially use maybe a, another kind of like big, big key acquisition, but I would feel pretty good about them. Their attack line is similar. They have Westberg, Vince D'Alto. I don't honestly don't even know who that is. Uh, Ryder car. They just signed him in the, in the off season.

[01:35:00] And I know he's never played in the PLL. I don't know who he is. Uh, Ryder Garnsey, Chris Cavanaugh, Jackson Morrill and Brennan Nick turned. I think those last four right there could be your attack line and you'd be great. You'd be real great. And that's not even including, you know, a, a veteran pro like Westberg.

[01:35:24] So they, I don't know that they are going to be Atlas and archers good, but they are, they were, they were hands down the worst team in the league last year. The water dogs technically finished with a worse record, but like six of their losses were by one goal. The woods were getting pummeled. The woods were not good last year.

[01:35:52] They were, I think they were significantly worse than the water dogs, even though the water dogs technically ended with a worse record. They're not going to be anywhere near the worst team in the, in the league this year. And not unless there's just a crap ton of growing pains with a brand new coaching staff and all of these new players, which to be fair is possible.

[01:36:18] But I just think, I think they are going to be probably third or fourth in the league this year. And obviously they'll make the playoffs and could make a little noise again. I don't think that their archers are Atlas good just yet, but I think they are really, really set up.

[01:36:41] And if you think about giving Joe Spelina another free agency window and draft next year to take this roster and make it even better. I mean, the woods, the woods could be really good for a while. And now to the loser. I think everyone knows who the loser of the draft was.

[01:37:10] It's honestly, probably not even very close. Uh, I think, I think pretty much everybody except for the Carolina chaos did at least well enough. They, they addressed their needs. They progressed in some manner. They're obviously, like I said, the woods got significantly better. They are for me, the clear winners.

[01:37:36] Uh, everyone else was kind of between that and, and good enough. Uh, the Carolina chaos are the only team that I think had a bad draft and they had. a bad draft. Like I, it's not even close. Every single aspect of their draft was baffling.

[01:38:02] Like just mind numbingly baffling. It started when the draft, uh, the draft basically kicked off. I was doing the, uh, OTB, uh, draft podcast. And like I said, Kyle Bennett was at ESPN and he hopped on with a, he was, he was kind of doing this thing where he was like hopping in and hopping out with us.

[01:38:30] And he hopped in and he's like, Hey, we're hearing that the Carolina chaos are probably going to trade. It looks like there might be a player involved. And we were like, okay, cool. Because. One of the things that Spencer Ford and Roy Colsey had been saying was that they really wanted to leave this draft with four players. They only had three picks. So the.

[01:38:58] They wanted, they clearly wanted to make some kind of move where they could leave with four, whether that was. Trading for a, a player already in the PLL or trading back for an additional pick, whatever. So we hear that this trade is going to happen and we're like, okay, cool. Sweet. Then it pops up. Trade has happened. I don't know if you guys were like us, we had the volume down a little bit low, so we couldn't, we couldn't hear.

[01:39:26] Cause obviously we were talking and you can see the archers come up. They, they are now picking instead of the Carolina chaos. And we're like, Oh cool. The trade must've happened. But then. They were talking to somebody. I think whoever had picked. They were, they were talking to the coach. I think it was a Brian Holman for the cannons picked at four. So they were talking to him and then they went to a commercial and we're all like, wait, what's happening? What's happening.

[01:39:53] And then of course, when they come back, they announced the trade and we're looking at it and we're like, wait. They just traded back. And for nothing, like they got nothing. There was no player. There was no additional pick. They literally just pick swapped. They, they technically moved up a few picks from the middle of the third to the end of the second.

[01:40:17] So they now had two second round picks, but they didn't really gain anything other than again, a few, a few places. And that was weird because again, they've been talking about how they wanted to leave this draft with four players. But okay. Pick swapping isn't too big of a deal.

[01:40:45] I guess they, even when you don't win anything, it's a, it's a pick swap for the sake of pick swapping, but whatever. The archers moved up to take Brendan Lavelle from Penn, who is arguably the best poll in the draft. It depends on kind of who you were asking. Some people had him. Some people had be vibe Virch.

[01:41:10] It just kind of depended on, on who you asked, but arguably one of the better defenders. Cool. The chaos pick comes around at eight. The one that they have traded back for at eight. They pick Owen Hiltz. That that's fine.

[01:41:33] Owen Hiltz is a good player who can absolutely shoot the lights out, but it felt like a reach. It felt like someone who would have been around at a later draft pick. He's also someone that kind of relies on another player to get him the ball. He does. He's not really a ball dominant player. Uh, at, at Syracuse, he, he plays off of Joey Spelina a lot.

[01:42:02] And there isn't really someone on the chaos roster that does that. Josh Wada a little bit. I don't think that he's quite of the caliber and I like Josh Wada. I'm a Duke guy. He's a Duke guy. Like I like Josh Wada. I'm not trying to hate on him. I just don't think that he is of the caliber of player that, that you would feel really comfortable with him in this position.

[01:42:31] So it felt really weird, especially considering that, you know, Sam King and Chris Cavanaugh and guys that are kind of ball dominant, uh, players are still available and can be picked up. But again, Owen Hiltz is a good player. It was weird, but I think we can let it slide depending on how the rest of the draft goes.

[01:43:00] So then we get in to the second round. The chaos had the 13th and 16th pick. That was the fifth and eighth in, in the second round, the 13th and 16th overall. And at 13, they take Levi Verch. Which again, Levi is very good.

[01:43:28] Like I said, depending on who you were asking, arguably the best available poll felt a little weird that we pick swapped for someone to take a poll. And we took a poll.

[01:43:44] Like I, it just didn't make, if we were going to take a poll, why didn't we take Brennan LaValle or, or Levi Verch for that matter at our regular position and not worry about the trade? I don't know. It just, it didn't make a lot of sense, but again, arguably the best poll in the draft.

[01:44:07] So not the end of the world, but then three picks later with Sam King still available. They picked up another poll in Jack McDonald, the Carolina chaos draft party in Charlotte was pretty livid.

[01:44:28] They, I don't think that we have reached the point of like jets fans booing picks during the draft or anything. Uh, at least not publicly. Uh, I wouldn't be surprised if several of the, the Carolina chaos fans at that draft party were thinking it inside their head.

[01:44:52] Uh, but they, they, they seem to be a little shocked, but they did not, uh, really, uh, express that feeling.

[01:45:05] But all that to say, it was a really, really puzzling start to life in Carolina for Spencer Ford and Roy Colsey, who spent most of the last week talking about how they had an incredible defense and we're looking to build around it and, and get better at the other end of the field. And then they drafted two poles with three picks.

[01:45:34] And I'm sure I don't have to remind you, but this was the worst offense in the league last year by a decent margin. If you remember, this was the team that scored one goal in the playoffs last season, one goal. And it didn't look like they were likely to score a second. And they've only gotten worse since the end of the season with Josh Burnley.

[01:46:01] They currently only have two players on their roster that scored more than 15 points last season. Ross Scott and the off season pickup of Josh Sawada, both of whom had 16 points last season. It does sound like Will Bowen might be out for the season, which does kind of provide some context for the defensive heavy draft.

[01:46:28] But even without Will Bowen, it feels like getting a third or fourth poll through free agency and the player pool seems significantly more doable. And then finding a 20 plus point score that will lead your offense into this new future with, you know, an all new staff and, and players and stuff.

[01:46:53] So the whole draft was just bizarre and, and we'll see maybe, maybe they know some stuff we don't know. And maybe this all works out, but right here, right now, I don't know anyone who, who really understands what happened. Not, not chaos fans, not beat writers.

[01:47:21] Nobody really understands what happened with the Carolina chaos on Tuesday. They could have gotten Chris Cavanaugh, Sam King, and still gotten either Levi Virch or left with Jack McDonald. And been in a much, much better position than they are right here, right now.

[01:47:50] All of those players were available at the times that they were picking and that's without them acquiring any other player or pick with a better trade backwards. And again, that still just blows my mind. I've never seen a team trade back and get nothing for it. The bare minimum is another pick. The archers had the very last pick in the draft, the last pick in the fourth round.

[01:48:20] Why couldn't they have gotten that in addition to the pick swap and left with four players? With that pick, the archers got Spencer Ford from Maryland and Fairfield.

[01:48:31] And I don't know, maybe he's not the guy that's going to turn this franchise around, but he's another option in a very underwhelming offensive scheme that could have provided goals and offensive firepower for this awful, awful chaos offense. And instead they just got nothing, nothing like still.

[01:49:01] Now I'm recording this Thursday night. It's been two days. I still can't wrap my mind around that draft. It makes no sense to me whatsoever. All right. That is going to do it for this week's episode. I really appreciate you tuning in, whether you listen, you watch, or you just had me on in the background while you were doing the dishes.

[01:49:29] If you enjoyed it, please make sure to again, comment, subscribe, leave a review, whatever the platform lets you do show some love. It really helps us. I will be back next week with the interview with Caitlin McDonough, the beat writer for the WLL. But until then, I will catch you guys on the internet.