Ep. 25 - Fixing All-Star Weekend

Neil Barrett (00:04.278)
My sound just cut out.

Brandon Hooten (00:07.277)
your sound.

Neil Barrett (00:09.344)
That's really weird. They're like cut out.

Brandon Hooten (00:10.817)
I my mic, but that was it. Like, see?

Neil Barrett (00:14.035)
maybe that's what it was. The ambient noise was it? Yeah, okay, yeah, that's what it was. That's what it was.

Brandon Hooten (00:19.903)
Alright, then I'll leave it, then now it's consistent at least.

Neil Barrett (00:22.88)
Yeah, yeah, I'll cut it. I'll cut it out of the thing. It's no problem. And it's honestly not that bad right now. But when it was gone, all of sudden it was like, wait, what's happening? There's no it sounded like like it just all dropped out of my ear. So. All right, let's. Do this, I guess. Welcome, welcome, welcome to the run out. I am Neil Barrett. He is Brandon Hooten this week. He is back.

Brandon Hooten (00:32.803)
That's funny.

Neil Barrett (00:50.702)
Brandon, welcome back. You probably don't know. I don't know if you know this. This is officially the 25th episode of The Runout. That's pretty cool. I'm not entirely sure. I had I had a podcast like eight, nine, ten years ago, something like that. I don't know that we ever made it to 25 episodes. So I feel I'm feeling a little accomplished by having hit that number.

Brandon Hooten (01:15.321)
That's a success to win.

Neil Barrett (01:17.516)
Yeah, for sure. The first the first milestone of many, hopefully Brandon is back. of all, how was the last two weeks or whatever for you? Getting getting settled in over there.

Brandon Hooten (01:30.009)
good. Yep, last week was a very busy week for me, photography wise, from literally start to finish. Kansas City was cool. It was like super hot. Honestly, it wasn't even super hot per se. It was just like hot with humidity. And generally I can do one or the other. I'm not one of those people that hates humidity personally. I just didn't like having them together.

Neil Barrett (01:39.5)
You

Neil Barrett (01:50.21)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (01:58.637)
But honestly, there was some good cloud coverage out there, so it wasn't horrible. It was just like, you walk outside and it all hits you at once. And then you go back inside and every place is freezing. Yeah, and then you're just like, man, I need to shower again. But no, it was cool. Yeah, yeah. The only other human place I've really been to is Florida. And I don't remember it being like that. I remember it being humid, but not like, gross.

Neil Barrett (02:06.126)
You're sticky.

Yeah, that sounds like Mississippi.

Neil Barrett (02:20.012)
Hmm.

Brandon Hooten (02:24.756)
So I don't know, I hear that it gets worse out there like in July. So I'm glad it was there at the beginning and not the end.

Neil Barrett (02:25.966)
With a pin I...

Neil Barrett (02:32.012)
Yeah. Yeah, I think it depends where you are in Florida, because like where I've been in a lot in Florida is like on the ocean. So like, yeah, it's really humid. But you also have like that breeze coming in off the ocean all the time. It's not as bad. I don't imagine there's much of an ocean breeze in Kansas City, Missouri, though. Yeah, for sure. So that is a perfect lead in Brandon was at the All-Star game this weekend.

Brandon Hooten (02:43.01)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (02:47.566)
It'd have to blow real hard to get over there for sure.

Neil Barrett (02:59.468)
This was your first time at the All-Star game, I believe, yeah? I'm wondering just kind of overall what you thought about the event and kind of what you got to experience while you were there.

Brandon Hooten (03:10.702)
It was cool. It was different from like a regular weekend. I mean, for obvious reasons, but just the flow of it was different because, you know, a normal weekend you go into it and it's like, you know, you're going to have full kind of nonstop action for several hours. This was more so like first day kind of slow with the skills comp. And then you get like a bit of action there with the women's game. And then the next day, like is when there was more fans kind of showing up for the men's game.

And it was just cool seeing like the best of the best all at once, you know, on the same teams, like messing around with each other, talking trash to each other. They were all clearly very hot as well. So I felt okay about that. I wasn't the only one dying.

But yeah, it was cool. I think this is actually my first time seeing Paul in person. Most times, most weekends I've been to, it's just been Mike. So seeing both of them there was cool and the stadium there was awesome. it's, I can't wait for when our NWSL soccer stadium gets built. Cause if it's anything like that, it's going to be immaculate. So great views, great lighting the entire time. Just fun time all around.

Neil Barrett (04:23.512)
Nice. Nice. That's fun. I- Watching it, I was kind of like, I kind of wish I had gone, but, you know, it is one of those- those things. And then-

Brandon Hooten (04:31.692)
Yeah, but you were probably sitting in nice air-conditioned place, so... You know?

Neil Barrett (04:35.244)
That's true. That's true. I was I was I don't know about nice air conditioned place, but air conditioned place for sure. So let's get in to the weekend a little bit. The like you mentioned on Friday, the thing that we started with was the skills competition. We're not going to go into every single, you know, breakdown of every single event, but we started with the Gully Wars.

Brandon Hooten (04:43.074)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (05:02.07)
I know you had some difficulty, you were there photographing and you had some difficulty with Gully Wars just because of the nature of the event and people standing around and stuff and not being able to shoot it very well. But on TV, it was a lot of fun to watch. It's something that I know Michael Harrison, our friend,

with the Red Legion in Carolina had been wanting to see us do a goalie wars after the MLS did it in their All-Star game a couple years ago and I I thought I thought it was really fun. I know a lot of the the commentary I saw online said that it was really fun. The WLL version was won by Taylor Moreno. The PLL version was won by Liam Intamin.

Several several of those goalies were slinging it. It was it was really entertaining to watch. It was really fun again on TV. I know you you didn't have the best time with that that specific event, but really on TV it was a lot of fun. And then we had the accuracy challenge, which Izzy Scane won for the WLL and Chris Cavanaugh won for the PLL. I I don't know what your thoughts are on the accuracy challenge, but.

It feels like we gotta do something different soon. This is not...

Brandon Hooten (06:24.333)
Yeah, it almost feels like there needs to be like a type of shot involved in it, like different spots or something, because seeing them just pick up a ball and just immediately shoot it right away, it's just very anticlimactic. Like, I would love to see like a Brennan O'Neal sweeping over the top. Like, how many times can we do that? You know, obviously you'd have to then extend the timeframe, but like, you know, that type of stuff or like dodging down the alley or just something so it's more interactive, I guess.

Neil Barrett (06:38.338)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (06:46.914)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (06:55.041)
would be my only critique of it. You know, cause it is cool seeing them like hit targets, but especially once they start finding the rhythm and they're shooting the same target over and over and over and over. And the announcer literally is saying, boy, that top right's getting hit a lot. And it's like, okay, like, you know, or maybe if, even if they just were like, Hey, you have to hit each one, go in order or, you know, you can't repeat or whatever.

Neil Barrett (07:02.478)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (07:17.006)
Well, that's the way they used to do it was it was the fastest to hit every single one of them. That's way they did it the first couple of years. yeah, especially it was a little tough watching Izzy's game, not even really. I mean, she was just kind of like flicking her wrist, which was which was cool. It was very accurate. Like it was cool to watch her shoot that way. But then I don't know, there was just something about it that not not that it was cheating, but I don't know, there was something about it that felt almost like gaming the system, you know, not

Brandon Hooten (07:46.775)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (07:46.806)
not going full out like that. So I have I have an idea, but we'll get to it in a little bit. Moving on to the lacrosse relay. This was one of the ideas that I had been banging a drum for for a good while was, you know, I'd love to see some kind of a relay, kind of like what the NBA does during their All-Star game. I don't know that it has where I think they I think they did it last year and then they did it, of course, this year.

Team Stars won with Jack Hanna, Matt Campbell, Sydney Black and Ali Meshiwani. But I know it was a big thing on social and they mentioned it in the booth. I don't know. You you were there. I don't know if you saw Jack Hanna, you know, on the beginning when they did the three man weave part, Jack Hanna passed the ball like a solid.

10 yards before he reached the cones that they're supposed to three man weave through. Like it was, it was blatantly obvious like well before the time. And then of course they won. and so yeah, there, it was one of the things that I had been banging my drum for, like I wanted to see it, but so far the two iterations that we've had, they just haven't hit the right balance of

Brandon Hooten (08:42.614)
Neil Barrett (09:03.628)
like events, the one where they do the passing on the bounce back is so goofy. And it's like, I'd rather see like target passing than someone standing 10 feet away from a bounce back trying to hit. I don't know. It just I still think there's a fun idea there, but I think it I think it could be worked on. Again, I have some ideas that I'll share in a little bit, but.

Brandon Hooten (09:14.688)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (09:28.492)
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know what it looks like in person. Is it is it any better? Does it does it also feel kind of goofy in person?

Brandon Hooten (09:36.054)
Yeah, and before I say what I'll say, I'm at a different perspective literally from being field level. So I do want to say that before I someone's like, no, it cool in person. Like it may look awesome from the second deck. I don't know. From my perspective, it was a bit odd and granted I wasn't really like listening for like how it was going to work, but it did feel like once it started, it was like, wait, where are we going? And what are we doing? And especially, I remember when

Neil Barrett (09:41.699)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (09:46.734)
Yeah, from the stance, yeah.

Brandon Hooten (10:03.831)
think it was Pat Cav was doing the bounce back or something and I was like does he have to do like a certain amount of Overhand behind the and it was like okay clearly he has to do behind the backs at some point because that's all of a sudden he's doing them But it was like just hard for me to follow granted I'm also trying to photograph it so it's I'm not again not paying attention the same way but it was like you start on one side of the field and Then they pass all the way to the other side of the field and now you have someone dodging and then like the ground ball pickup part I feel like half of those weren't even really getting picked up. It was just literally just like

Neil Barrett (10:09.069)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (10:12.878)
Thank

Brandon Hooten (10:32.353)
You know, like flipping pancakes for these guys. And I'm like, how are we counting these as like ground balls right here? But I think it's a good start. Like I like the idea of it. But like you said, it's missing maybe a little something.

Neil Barrett (10:53.656)
Yeah, I bumped really hard against the ground balls as well. They're like too close together. Like you have to pick them up and drop them immediately in order to get the next one. They're like way too close together. You got to do too many of them. I know on TV they announced the bounce back and did a half decent job of trying to explain it. I was really curious how well that translated in the stadium.

Brandon Hooten (11:06.604)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (11:21.868)
Skills comps are one of those things that I feel like really are a lot better to watch on TV because someone's explaining it like constantly. Whereas in the arena, you know, you don't have that commentator like telling you everything. So

Brandon Hooten (11:27.682)
Yep.

Brandon Hooten (11:36.108)
And I'm sure that it was put on like the Jumbotron that I just wasn't paying attention to. But like you're saying, it's not like he's walking you through, like the announcer is not walking you through it as it's happening. It was just like, they're moving on to the bounce back. You know, and then it's a stereotypical like, you know, however many more or whatever. And then the next thing, so.

Neil Barrett (11:39.114)
Yeah, probably.

Neil Barrett (11:45.058)
Mm.

Neil Barrett (11:49.923)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (11:56.76)
Right. Right. So, yeah, like I said, I've got some things that I'll bring up in just a minute, but let's move on to the last event of the skills competition. The fastest shot. Excuse me. the hell? I can't even breathe. I can't even breathe on my own, apparently. The WLL fastest shot was won by Charlotte North. She shot ninety five miles an hour. That is insane. I'm not even sure.

Brandon Hooten (12:08.829)
careful. Don't get too excited.

Neil Barrett (12:26.238)
like a full transparency. I'm not even sure I could shoot 45 with that with a women's stick. Like, I don't know how she's ripping it. And then the PLL fastest shot was won by Graham Hasek, who set the new fastest shot record at one hundred and twenty three miles an hour. That was crazy and impressive, especially because if you watch him shoot, it looks like he he still has.

Brandon Hooten (12:29.626)
no. No.

Neil Barrett (12:52.244)
another gear or two like he doesn't look like he's hardly trying at all. I think if you if he works on it and I don't know that he will, I'm sure hitting the fastest shot is very low on his list of of accomplishments. But if if he just kind of pulled his Zach Dorn and just kind of went went to work on it, I have no doubt he could break 130.

Brandon Hooten (12:56.926)
No.

Brandon Hooten (13:15.489)
Well, and I remember when Jared Newman broke it and set 121, he like jumped, he launched himself like over the line and then Graham went up there this weekend and literally, like I said in the chat, looked like he didn't even try. He just like kind of bunny hopped into it. And then even after he officially broke the record, he just kind of turned and smiled. It wasn't like a big like, I broke it. It was just like, nice. know, and it was like, and then what's funny is he broke Jared's record like four or five times.

Neil Barrett (13:22.189)
Yes.

Neil Barrett (13:28.566)
No.

Brandon Hooten (13:43.23)
Because he got 122 a couple times, I believe he got 121 once or twice. Like you're saying, I think if he just channeled all that, I think he could have probably gotten even, I mean over 125 for sure. I think it's in the cards.

Neil Barrett (13:43.33)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (13:47.427)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (13:55.534)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I was actually a little surprised he didn't hit one twenty five, though I think that's at least somewhat to do with the the structure of the thing. And I'll get to that in just a second, But yeah, all that to say, he I think should. I think he could legitimately break 130 with with.

some half decent effort into like trying to evolve his shot a little bit, because like you said, it didn't it did not even look like he was trying at all. And he and he the I think it was his first one that was one twenty two. His first shot right right off the bat. And it was like, he's he's already broken the record and he's not he doesn't look like he's trying and he's like not even warmed up. He's like not even in rhythm like he is so.

Brandon Hooten (14:25.708)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (14:31.606)
No.

Brandon Hooten (14:38.786)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (14:46.711)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (14:50.1)
That being said, let's let's talk about maybe some changes. I don't know. Again, you were there shooting. It's a it's a different thing on the field. So I made a list of some changes that I would like to see to the skills comp. And I wanted to get, I guess, your your opinion on them. The first one, the biggest one for me. And I think this.

I think this is not just about the skills comp, but this is this is about the whole All-Star weekend as a whole. Move it off of July 4th. I don't think July 4th was a good idea at all. It's the biggest reason, I think, is because it's too soon. Voting closed on the 23rd of June. That was barely four weeks into the season. I just don't

think that there are that's a good enough amount of time to evaluate who the All-Stars are. And I don't think it's a huge deal right now. Obviously, but if this league keeps progressing the way that they say they want it to All-Star Games are part of like in the major league sports, All-Star Games are part of contracts.

And if you make an all-star game, can be, that can get you a bonus in terms of money. And I just think that if this game is played at the end of the season, I think there are a lot of very different guys that would make this roster. I don't, I don't think there's any way Jared Bernhardt, if he continues playing the way that he has played the last couple of weeks, I don't think there's any way he's not an all-star for this, this season. can, I can even envision a, uh,

Brandon Hooten (16:10.784)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (16:39.346)
a world in which he wins midfielder of the year this year and he won't have even been an All-Star. And that, that's insane. That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

Brandon Hooten (16:51.466)
That's actually funny you bring that up because I was talking to my dad about that this weekend and I was like I don't see a reason why we can't just put this right the week before championship weekend like the NFL like and and the counter argument is obviously like well the NBA does it it's like well they play 41 games or whatever 60 games before they have you know what I mean like there's a good sample size and like you and I have talked about this a bunch where like you like you said there's not enough games to be like this guy's an all-star this guy's not

Neil Barrett (17:01.078)
Is it? Is it?

Neil Barrett (17:08.426)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (17:18.144)
My dad brought up too, like Canadian rookies, they have visa issues. They literally cannot make an All-Star team because they don't have any time. Like Owen Hiltz, he's been incredible, but he hasn't had enough time to even earn that.

Neil Barrett (17:21.794)
Yep. Yep.

Neil Barrett (17:30.698)
Yeah, fact, the the the best game he played was after the voting closed.

Brandon Hooten (17:37.045)
Yeah, and to that point too, like we start voting so early that I'm like, you've won good game and all of a sudden you're in and I won't name specific names, but I think we both agree like there are guys that made it that I don't think they're playing at an all-star level. Like it's just a fact, unfortunately, but because voting starts early, because they have a big name, all of a sudden now they're making all-star teams. And like you're saying, as soon as that stuff enters into contracts, that stuff's going to matter. Cause right now I don't-

Neil Barrett (17:41.165)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (18:06.924)
believe it is, so it's not a huge deal, but as soon as that comes into play, like, snubs actually matter. And you see guys care about that in other leagues.

Neil Barrett (18:16.344)
Yeah. And again, they don't they don't really care about the game, but being named an All-Star is a legitimate thing that affects, you know, the future of your your position in the league and stuff. so I'm just not a fan of it being this early. Number one, because it's so early in the season. Number two, I just don't think it's a good weekend for it. I don't think that.

that July 4th is a good weekend for us to host an event like this. And people keep wanting to point to like the Denver July 4th games and they're like, see, it's a good thing. But one, first and foremost, Denver's a home team. they, you're going to see the home team and it, and we'd send to remember the 30,000 number a lot that they could.

especially those last few years, they could get about $30,000 pretty much annually for that game. But we also tend to forget that when it first started, it wasn't like that. It was a thing that built, and it was a thing that became an annual tradition and built and built and built and built. And so I think that's a thing. But then also, think Denver is like the Buffalo Bandits in the NLL. They're the...

the gold standard, but they're they're a non repeatable gold standard. You you can do everything that Buffalo does and you won't have the same result. You can do everything that Denver does and you won't have the same result. It's just for whatever for whatever reason. That team and that city just had to have a connection and it just I don't know. It just it just works.

it worked there in ways that it doesn't work in other places. And this, think, is really hard. You're in a new market that isn't really a lacrosse market to speak of. You are in a fairly decent sized stadium. mean, it's not, you know, it's not Beaver Stadium in Penn State or anything. It's not a hundred thousand seats, but

Neil Barrett (20:33.038)
It was probably a big stadium for even a regular PLL weekend, again, especially considering that they aren't a lacrosse area by any stretch of the imagination. And don't get me wrong, I'm all for going new places and I'm really stoked to see that they were in Kansas City. And I think there's a lot of that that has to do with the ownership group, specifically of the Casey Current. That's her name, right? Casey Current? Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (20:59.242)
Yeah. Yeah.

Neil Barrett (21:02.226)
and potentially them maybe wanting to be a PLL ownership group. So I'm all for it. I just it just feels like it wasn't a great system. And so I think it needs to be moved off of July 4th for those two weekends. I think for those two reasons, I mean, I think I think people want to go. They want to do fireworks and, know, like it's just it's just not something that I think people want.

to do to go check out some brand new sport that they don't really know. And it's an all star game, all star games just across the board and any sport, all star games are a little a little fun for sure, but also a little goofy and a little bit relaxed. People aren't trying their hardest. I know people point to the WLL game and are like, yeah, they were really trying. And I'm like.

I mean, they probably weren't. They probably were trying slightly more than the men if kind of their one opportunity to showcase their ability this year. But I don't think they were taking it so seriously. Like, I don't think they were mad at each other about things, you know, like the idea that the the W.L.L. game was played at such a high level because they cared about it more. I don't know is is really all that accurate. So, yeah, all that.

Brandon Hooten (22:11.442)
No.

Neil Barrett (22:27.456)
being said, I think this kind of being what it is, being an all star game, being kind of a one off thing, it just I don't know, I felt funky. I wasn't for it. So that's that's my change. Number one. And again, that's more about the whole weekend as a whole. As for the individual competitions, accuracy, the accuracy challenge at this point is more about precision than accuracy.

It doesn't it's more about hitting the same target over and over and over and being able to repeat that shot over and over and over again than it is about sorry My father-in-law is mowing the lawn right outside this door everyone who can hear that I? Apologize our window. It's not a door He'll be gone in a couple minutes. I apologize but

the accuracy contest is more about precision and being able to hit that same target over and over and over again. And it's kind of boring and it's not really an accuracy contest. So I thought kind of what you thought was go back to the old trying hit each target as fast as possible. That's way more of an accuracy challenge and way more interesting, I think. But

I heard a suggestion that I think is even better and would be way more fun. This comes from Dan Arestia. If you have listened to his podcast sticks in, please do. It's great. I know I'm pretty sure he's talked about it there. I actually heard him talk about it in a group chat. So but I'm pretty sure he's put it out there several times. But his idea was that each target is a color, the different color, and someone is passing you

different colored balls and you have to take the ball and match it to the target. And I think maybe a good way to do it is maybe to make, maybe instead of making it like big giant targets, maybe making it like sections, zones of the goal or something so that you're hitting them more frequently. You're not trying to hit these little like six inch targets that.

Brandon Hooten (24:44.469)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (24:45.634)
that are hard to hit just regularly while you're also doing this. If you miss, obviously you get nothing. And if you hit the wrong target, you lose either a point or a few seconds or however you want to do it. And then the most points or the fastest, however, however you do it at the end of a set amount of time wins. I think that would be really fun. It would really kind of nail the accuracy idea down.

And then like you said, it would kind of add that element of not just kind of standing there and shooting or standing there and flicking your wrist in the case of Izzy Skean. So, I don't know, I thought that was a really, really cool idea and a really cool like thought process for it.

Brandon Hooten (25:35.475)
Yeah, in regards to that specifically, I think that actually is probably the best idea I've heard. But there has to be something that's done. It's just, it has to be engaging for everybody on TV, in person, like...

Neil Barrett (25:40.94)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (25:52.674)
It can't just be someone standing there. And the second part of this too, which couples into the fastest shot is like, I don't love the idea of doing like 90 % of it one day and then doing the rest at halftime of the game. For a lot of reasons, for starters, I found it harder to follow and think about who was still in it. Like obviously we knew Graham Hasek was in it cause he was breaking the record and it was like, you know, but like, then it was like the next day.

Neil Barrett (26:09.582)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (26:18.664)
you know, halftime comes and I'm like, sweet, I can go grab some water, use the restroom, come move sides of the field, like whatever. And especially as a fan, like you're going up doing the same things essentially. And then it's like, well, just kidding, cause now we have this thing to do. And okay, so now we have to, you know, do this and you don't want to miss that cause you paid money to be here and whatnot. and then also like at that point, like,

Neil Barrett (26:31.47)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (26:40.318)
You got guys that are tired because they're playing a game, like in the middle of it. You got the women who just got done not only doing the skills, but then played the game themselves. So now they're probably a little bruised or banged up or tired. And it's just, I personally am not a fan of stop, especially cause like you literally get to the last round. Like let's just play the last round. But like while we're all here, we're all fresh. Like let's just shoot, you know? So that was, it's a nitpicky thing for sure.

Neil Barrett (26:42.658)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (27:09.478)
I personally am just not a huge fan of like the two day thing for an event that in the grand scheme of things I don't think fans are really going like Like no bananas for the skills part of it. It is cool for like the lacrosse heads But for the average fan, especially like you were saying when you're going to a new place, that's not a lacrosse town You need to make it as simple and easy to follow as you can

Neil Barrett (27:33.39)
That was, that was point four for me. No, you're good, you're good. I was just saying like, yes, no, I'm with you because I had the same thing. The fastest shot being split makes no sense. Like you said, it's hard to follow. It does because the women already played and the men are in the middle of playing. Like you could tell everybody was way more worn out.

Brandon Hooten (27:36.635)
just jumping down the list.

Brandon Hooten (27:59.572)
Yep.

Neil Barrett (28:00.622)
And then also, like you said, you've already got to the end. Like, why are why are we stopping now? It reminds me. Did you see this? You probably didn't because you were shooting the All-Star weekend, but I don't know if you saw it at Wimbledon. I think I think it's Wimbledon. Wimbledon is going on right now. The early rounds anyway. And there was an American I cannot remember his name and.

He was playing and their game was going deep. Like it was, it was going hours and hours and hours. And finally about nine o'clock, they started being like, Hey, we should call this. Cause in tennis, if it goes to a certain point, they'll call it and come back and finish it the next day. And he's like, we should call this. We should call it. And both, both of the players were saying like, Hey, we should call that. But the guy wouldn't call it. They just kept playing, kept playing. It finally gets to the final point that would

win the game for this American kid and it's 929 and the ump decides to call the game and everyone's like what we've been asking for more than 30 minutes for you to move this game and then you wait they came back and played the next day he played he won in less than one minute he made them come back and play less than one yeah and it reminded me so much of this accuracy or the fastest shot thing of like

Brandon Hooten (29:09.769)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (29:18.324)
That's a wasted time.

Neil Barrett (29:27.008)
What are what are we doing? Just just do the final round like you said. It was really hard for me. I knew the fastest shot was coming up at halftime of the PLL All-Star game, and I legitimately couldn't remember who was in it. I knew obviously I knew Grandma Husick, but I couldn't remember who he was having to go against or, you know, and then did do the do the men and women go against each other in the final? I know that's what they did last year, but I don't think they did that this year. It was just the two and two, right?

Brandon Hooten (29:51.529)
No.

Yeah.

Neil Barrett (29:55.682)
And it was, it was just like weird. And then of course, the other part of the fastest shot that we didn't even talk about is the fact that they have shorties and long poles going against each other. It's so dumb. It's so dumb. And no one, like there's a reason why the only time a shorty has won in the last 10, 15 years that I can remember was the year that the one pole that made the finals couldn't hit the target. They kept missing the target.

Brandon Hooten (30:03.474)
I was just about to say that.

Neil Barrett (30:22.124)
And so that was like the one year because, you have to you have to make it the you have to make the goal in order for the shot to count. So that was like the one year in like 10 or 15 years that I can remember. There may have been one or two Zagdorns and they're somewhere probably if you go back far enough. But yeah, it's like the one time I can remember in any kind of like recent memory where a poll hasn't won. And it's like, what are we doing?

Brandon Hooten (30:45.746)
It almost feels like they need to have like two separate competitions where you have like a group of short sticks and a group of long pulls because we all know the long pulls gonna win but it was awesome watching Matt Campbell shoot I think he had 112 I believe it was like that's insane and it was entertaining to watch him do that the problem is then the long stick comes behind them and Shoots literally 11 miles per hour more than him and it's like well, okay So like what was the point right? But there are a number of like attack men midfiel- I mean even like

Neil Barrett (30:49.196)
Yep.

Okay.

Neil Barrett (30:57.932)
Yeah. Yeah.

Hmph.

Neil Barrett (31:09.89)
without looking like he's trying.

Brandon Hooten (31:15.274)
you know, short stick demitties and I'm like, I think you could just go and launch a lacrosse ball. And not only that, but if you do that way, then you have basically three events because you have the women's, the long pole and the shorties. And then if you do want to have something at halftime, just save one whole event for that. And be like today we're doing long poles, today we're doing shorts or whatever you want to do. Um, but yeah, I'm with it. just, I knew as soon as the list came out, I was like, okay, so Matt Campbell's not winning obviously.

Neil Barrett (31:43.8)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (31:44.65)
He put up a great fight, but it's like it's just not happening

Neil Barrett (31:47.822)
Yeah, no, when when he hit 112, it made me go like, oh, I want to see like Miles Jones. I want to see maybe maybe a Sergio Perkovich, maybe like a Graham Bundy Jr. See some of these guys. I mean, I mean, even even a Brandon O'Neill like would be great in a shorty, but there's no point in him.

Brandon Hooten (31:53.725)
Yup.

Neil Barrett (32:08.638)
doing a fastest shot competition. Like, honestly, the fact that they even got Matt Campbell in the fastest shot competition kind of blew my mind. I was like, I can't believe a shorty is volunteering to do this. They know they're not going to I don't know, but yeah, that's the fastest shot is probably the most high profile, but also the one that I feel like is the most like.

Brandon Hooten (32:11.282)
No.

Brandon Hooten (32:21.171)
Right.

Neil Barrett (32:34.21)
problematic. Like there's so many issues with it like we have discussed here and I don't I don't understand why we keep doing the same thing over and over and over again. And then

Brandon Hooten (32:44.509)
Well, and especially, just one more thing on that point too, I just thought of this. There were clearly more fans that came to day two than day one. So if, and mind you, day one was the Fourth of July. So chances are those fans that did not come Friday were out doing fireworks with their families, they were watching fireworks somewhere else, they weren't watching the weekend. So if you come to day two now and at halftime you're like, wait, they're only doing these two? you know, you're confused, because then it's like, where's the rest of the competition?

And again, like I said earlier, like the lax heads know what's happening because we keep up with it. But the places that don't watch lacrosse are confused. it's just like, okay. Cause now you're like, is it just two people doing it? Like, was there a competition before this? It's just, it's a whole world of just like confusion that I don't think needs to be there.

Neil Barrett (33:33.012)
Mm Yeah. Yeah. And then. I as we have been talking, I've come up with an idea, but we'll get to that in a minute. The next one for me is what we talked about a little bit earlier, the lacrosse relay. I again, I think there's a good idea in there, but it's not working at all. One thing I want to I would want to see is get goalies involved. My my initial thought was and maybe maybe we're not

Maybe this is kind of a dream scenario when maybe the All-Star game is maybe a little bit bigger of a deal when the league itself is is a bigger deal and you can really kind of afford to have maybe some guys who aren't All-Stars be there. But I was like, man, wouldn't it be cool if you could do like a team, like literally a team team? like the Carolina Chaos have Blaisreardon, maybe like Jack Rowlett.

and then, you know, a couple of midfielders or attackmen or whatever. And it starts. You get the goalies involved. So it starts an idea I had. And some of this stuff needs to be like legitimately fleshed out. But I always hate when we do goalie competitions and it starts with somebody shooting because that guy is usually just like popcorn and shots at them. Like he's not really trying. So I thought.

What if one of the opposing teams is shooting on you and if they make a goal, they get to take a second off or, know, or whatever, a point off or however you want to do it. That way there's an incentive for them to actually score and you actually have to challenge the goalie to make a save. He makes the save, then it's an outlet pass. Then maybe that guy's dodging and then tries to make a pass on the run or something. But it's just it should be much more about

game-like scenarios, not standing flat-footed on a bounce back, not picking up five ground balls that are all three feet from each other, know, full, full, you know, maybe not full field sprints, but like there should be some midfielders doing like a box-to-box kind of sprint, you know, just different things. I really think target passing would be fun.

Brandon Hooten (35:46.153)
I think something kind of similar to like the NFL combine would be cool, but make it more of like a connection. So like even something like having guys run on a straight line at some point and catching passes from different people or, then tie that in with some type of precision passing as well. Or something along those lines kind of to where it's, there's a lot more movement.

Neil Barrett (36:09.454)
Yeah, movement for sure.

Brandon Hooten (36:10.28)
Because like you said, as soon as they got past the initial spot, the pass, and then the dodging part, then it was like, okay, one dude's just doing ground balls, you know, like you said, really close. You pass it off, okay, now he's standing still in the middle of the field. All that momentum now is just this guy passing to himself. Then you pass the next guy and he's standing still. And if it takes him more than one shot, now he's just standing there doing the accuracy challenge again by himself.

Neil Barrett (36:19.598)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (36:33.1)
Yeah. One. And the idea of standing like dead center in the goal, like and trying to catch, like turn to catch a pass that then you just kind of like turn and shoot is like. What what part of what part of the game is the three man weave? What part of the game is standing on a bounce back? What part of the game is standing with your back to the goal to catch a pass just to turn in the exact same position and throw it at the goal like?

There's so many of these things. They're like, they're like really bad practice drills. They're not even like good practice drills. Like they're nothing that I would put Institute in a practice plan for high school kids. They're, they're that level of like bad practice drills that you've met. And like, why is that fun? The other thing too, is that only two teams was incredibly boring. You know, like you already knew, okay,

This one team has to beat this. You know, one team goes and they set a record and it's like, OK, now all they got to do is faster. And basically their time, they just needed to hit a shot on the first try, which they did. And that was the difference. And it's like, I don't know. It wasn't super fun, but I do feel like there's a good idea there. And then my last my last thing that I want to see. And again, this is probably more down the line, but I want to see a Legends game.

Brandon Hooten (37:46.301)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (38:02.902)
I want to see. I don't care. It doesn't have to be like a full 10 on 10. Doesn't even have to be like a padded up game. You know, like the NFL does their like flag football game with their like legends alumni. Maybe they called alumni. I don't remember, but they're like legends, like flag football game. I'd be fine with watching. Maybe not even maybe not even a full again padded up like sixes kind of thing, especially because that's a lot of running, but some kind of like street or.

You know, some kind of like small legends game would be fun, like get Kyle Harrison out there, mic'd up, get get Casey Powell out there, you know, get that would be so much fun. And for me, that's like a skills that could be like the skills comps like big event at the end. You know, you go through these skills competitions, complete them all. Do do the.

all the rounds of accuracy and fastest shot and all that. And then it builds up to this like celebrity. Maybe and maybe that's even better too. It's like it's like some alumni, maybe some celebrities, maybe just some, you know, get the get the stick talk boys out on the field, you know, get get some legends out there, get maybe some other influencers who aren't lacrosse players, you know, like the celebrity softball game for the for the Major League Baseball. like.

That's a fun event. And I get it. It's a little goofy and it maybe doesn't have the world's best ratings. don't I don't know what the ratings are for the celebrity softball game, but, you know, just a fun event that like people can enjoy and see and stuff. And again, I think that's a that's a good time to bring out influencers or celebrities and, you know, who could draw some eyes to the game. Like, I don't know. I think.

Brandon Hooten (39:43.814)
Yep.

Brandon Hooten (39:48.007)
I mean, there are already a good amount of those there as well. It's not like, I mean, Scotty was there. I think Dukes was there. I mean, shoot, get RJ involved if he wants. you know, just something, just to try stuff. I mean, you lose nothing by trying these things. Like you said, I think they're all good ideas right now. It's just expanding on those and making them better over time.

Neil Barrett (39:51.33)
Right.

Neil Barrett (40:06.072)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (40:15.342)
So, I don't know, those were just kind of my thoughts on at least the skills competition portion of the game. We can move on to the actual All-Star games. We will start with the WLL All-Star game where Team Izzy defeated Team North 24 to 20. This was fast and fun and our first kind of glimpse at what the WLL will

eventually look like. They played 10 on 10. Most most people are. More aware of the college women's game, which is 12 on 12. There are some different rules. The one thought I had watching this game, and this is going to be a little goofy, is. Where was the WLL like four or five years ago, because I I feel like the WW the WLL.

solved the sixes, an un-drum and like watching that, I was like, man, the, the, the rule set that we were trying to accomplish to make the Olympics, we just accomplished with the WLL in terms of like same, generally the same rule set, same field, same markings, you know, everything, everything that the IOC wanted from the sport of lacrosse.

Other than perhaps, you know, limiting the roster size. That's probably the only only thing that it doesn't do super well, but. Just a goofy thought I had watching that, otherwise the game was electric, it was fun, it was back and forth. I do think that they were they were playing a little bit harder again, like I said, I don't think that they were.

I don't think that they were treating it like an NCAA championship or a world championship or would they just come back from the Pan America games or something like that where they won a gold medal like the week before? Like I don't think they were playing that hard, but it was fun.

Brandon Hooten (42:24.549)
Yeah, I don't know. I kind of disagree because I think they're playing harder than like I was expecting. There was definitely moments where like you could see girls get like pretty frustrated with different calls or whatnot. And I was like, are we playing a serious game here? Are we going to like mess around? Like, you know, it was just like one of those. overall, I thought it was like it was a pretty good product. I was kind of skeptical when I realized it wasn't sixes because that's all we'd seen from the WLL as of now.

Neil Barrett (42:49.838)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (42:52.187)
But I thought 10 on 10 worked perfectly. Forgive me for not knowing the correct terms, but like the shot where they do in college lacrosse where like it's just one girl like holding the stick on the arc. Yeah, that I don't know if that's in this rule set, but it didn't come up at all. So I love that because that's so confusing for even people like myself trying to watch. And generally, I mean.

Neil Barrett (43:02.732)
That eight yard, eight meter,

Neil Barrett (43:14.84)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (43:18.791)
I thought the talent was there. It was cool seeing some of the women that aren't in the WLL playing this to be like, okay, if we add some more teams here, we can get some quality players. And overall, was pleased with it. I felt like there was, like the fans, thought were into it, generally speaking, which was good to see. And yeah, mean, Izzy's scan was crazy, Charlotte North is crazy, so.

Neil Barrett (43:36.696)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (43:45.902)
just wish that the game had been on Saturday and you could have had the two All-Star games. I think you'd have had a way better crowd for that WLL All-Star game. I'm not sure why they decided to do that. I don't know if it was, know, perf issues or I don't know what the reasoning was. But I bumped a little bit against that. Maybe it was just to have something beyond the skills because the skills count for the PLL.

Brandon Hooten (43:55.174)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (44:14.99)
and the WLL is fairly quick. It was what an hour, maybe an hour and a half, maybe it was it was very quick. So maybe it was just to kind of have something else. Although my thought was, I mean, is it is it too much to do the two games and the skills comp all on Saturday?

Brandon Hooten (44:19.003)
Yeah. It was fast.

Brandon Hooten (44:36.825)
I think so, at least in a place like that where it's like super hot and humid just because like once like especially Saturday once that game was done like I was like I I want to go sit inside I don't want to stay out here and you know do more so I think that'd probably be a bit much I don't think two games would necessarily be too much I just think it could be pushing it depending on how long each game takes

Neil Barrett (44:40.884)
Sweltering, yeah.

Neil Barrett (44:48.344)
But.

Neil Barrett (44:54.605)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (45:00.002)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (45:04.034)
Yeah, I feel like two games would be OK. It's when you start adding the the skills comp. But then I'm also like, but yeah, but the skills comp isn't going to hold on its own. So which maybe is which is maybe why they moved the game. But I don't know. I I just felt like I just felt like, man, I wish they had played that game on on Saturday because I think they would have had a better crowd. Although, again, like you said, the crowd that was there did seem into it and they were enjoying it. So

Brandon Hooten (45:13.736)
Yeah, you have to attach it to something.

Neil Barrett (45:34.07)
That's good, at least. I did see a lot of comments online this week about, I hope that they that they get a full league. They deserve it and all this stuff. And I'm like, they're getting a full like, what are you what are we talking about? Like, that's that's the whole thing. That's the whole thing that we're doing here. I don't know. I just thought that was so funny. It was like, yeah, like, that's what we're doing. It's like people have already forgotten that

Brandon Hooten (45:50.85)
It's in the works. It's in the works.

Neil Barrett (46:03.744)
AU was supposed to be playing this summer. And then at the last minute after this announcement, they canceled their season. And I, for one, have always thought like, don't don't rush a season now. Like if your plan was to start next year or the year after, whenever whatever their plan was, I'd rather I'd rather wait a little bit longer and let's do this right than like rush out some some half thought product.

Brandon Hooten (46:28.583)
Yep.

Neil Barrett (46:31.276)
or whatever. I want the women to play. I want the WLL to exist and stuff, but I want it. I wanted to exist in 10, 15, 20 years from now, not just, you know, one, two, three seasons, which has been kind of the pattern for women's lacrosse leagues is that they get built for a year or two. I think AU was what, four, maybe, maybe five seasons and now folded though admittedly that's not all about AU and everything. So

know, there is that, but, you know.

Brandon Hooten (47:03.399)
It's also just easy, it's easy to sit back and be like, they deserve it, we need to have this, da da. But you also have to have a demand there that isn't just you. Like, I'm a fan of a lot of things that I recognize can't hold up to a full season right now. You know, like, it just, that's what it is. And I think having games like this where you're testing out like, hey, here's a 10v10, let's see how this works. And you know, hey, you don't have to play extremely hard, but let's play, you know, let's be competitive and, you know, display it well. And all of a sudden it's like,

Neil Barrett (47:12.718)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (47:32.999)
Oh, this is a great product. Like now you want to watch it, you know? So I think you have to test it. And obviously we know the situation with AU, but even if AU was still around, the WLL would still have to test this stuff to make sure that like it can hold up. Cause all of us, I mean, we hear about this with the PLL, if you start adding teams and there's no demand, it folds and now it looks like a failure again. And you know, then in 10 years, then we're clamoring again for another league. And it's like, okay, but you have to do it correctly. You have to set the foundation.

and then build so everyone online that's talking about that like it's on the way but just give it some time it's kind of getting ridiculous of every post is like give them a league it's like yeah it's coming like don't worry it's in the works

Neil Barrett (48:15.766)
We're we're working on it. But it's funny, too, because because I kind of always thought even before you was like, yeah, we're not going to do a season. I this is what I expect. I expected them to do an all star game that was kind of a showcase of what the W.L.L. would be or would be or whatever. I think they may they may kind of look at the game and say, hey, what worked, what didn't, what can we change to make better or whatever? But by and large, this is

kind of what I would expect, you know, a 10 on 10 on a PLL field, because at least for the kind of immediate future, until teams like really, really settle in to their home locations, I'd imagine. you know what? Let's not even say that. if next year the Boston Canons play a home

you know, schedule like a traditional sports home in a way schedule and the Boston Guard kind of latch onto that. The idea is still going to be that they're playing on the same field that we don't have to realign multiple times, that we don't have to, you know, pay to do this and that and stuff like the idea that they're going to play on a PLL field with the same markings and

You know, just kind of modify the ruleset is exactly what I have kind of always thought. I'm surprised to hear so many people that have not that thought because I don't really understand what they're expecting to see. But all that to say.

Brandon Hooten (49:59.366)
I know it I became a fan personally because I don't I don't like the women's rulebook in college I think it's it's I think it's too confusing for the average fan and Like in my aspect I am the average fan coming into this late. So seeing them play six days I was like, okay, I know what I'm expecting like I know how this works and then you see him come play 10v10 It's like okay. I know exactly what's happening. I can follow it easily I know all the women because I've seen the majority of them or heard their names before

Neil Barrett (50:03.17)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (50:07.309)
Hmm

Neil Barrett (50:24.248)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (50:29.402)
You know, like, I mean, I bought a WLL jersey because I was like, this is awesome, you know? But then if you're one of those people that's like, no, needs to be like traditional. It's like, well, there's not going to be demand for that then because people like, like you're saying to have the same things, they can follow it like every time, no matter what the game or league in this case is.

Neil Barrett (50:49.966)
Yeah, like I turn on a women's soccer game and I know what I'm watching because it's the same thing I turn on. I turn on a women's basketball game. I know what I'm watching because same thing. And I know that there are some women's lacrosse purists that that want to like keep kind of the sanctity of what women's lacrosse is. And I'm I totally get that. And if I was you, I would probably be saying the same thing because I I have those feelings about.

Brandon Hooten (50:54.249)
Right. Right.

Neil Barrett (51:18.126)
Field LaCrosse about traditional like Field LaCrosse. And I don't love to see changes. I'm not a big Sixus fan because of some of the things that it abandons from like traditional Field LaCrosse. But. But I mean, it is.

Brandon Hooten (51:31.195)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (51:37.632)
It is really hard when even the lacrosse community itself, when half of the lacrosse community itself doesn't understand what they're watching when they turn on the women's lacrosse game. And some of that is probably on us and we should take more responsibility to try and learn the game. I'm with you, but it would be a lot easier if I could turn on a game and have.

any understanding of what I was watching. The only thing that carries over is put the rubber ball in the back of the net. That's like the only thing that carries over everything else. I don't understand what I'm watching. So anyway, you mentioned buying a jersey, and I just wanted to point out one other thing I've desperately want to see changed. I know that the PLL and WLL are kind of acting as two separate entities under the same umbrella. But for the love of God, can we get

Brandon Hooten (52:04.356)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (52:25.942)
one store. It apples, it absolutely baffles me that I can't go buy a WLL jersey and a PLL hat at the same time. The PLL cards came out last week or two weeks ago or whenever that was, and I bought some and I was going to buy a PLL jersey to or a WLL jersey too. But I couldn't because it's completely different website. And I was like, well, I just I'm not doing it. I just I.

Brandon Hooten (52:28.844)
Amen.

Neil Barrett (52:51.414)
I would like to at some point I still am planning to but I would have I would have already done it if it was right there but it isn't.

Brandon Hooten (52:58.041)
Yes, and while we're on that topic, if, once they integrate the websites, if we could have a drop down that just is like Boston, California, like that way we can look at both, you know, palms and woods at the same time or whatever. That way we don't, we have to go back and forth. I'd like to be able to just be like, I want this and this, you know, whatever. Second thing is when are we going to get GameSync for WLL games? I want to be able to GameSync. I would like, like I would have loved for this weekend to get a badge.

to be like, you were at the first 10 v 10 women's lacrosse game that wasn't sixes, something. Because I was looking in the app and there wasn't an option until the men's game. I'm like, that's awesome. But I want to be able to also support the women's league and get that going. So that's another thing I was thinking about I think should be added to the app.

Neil Barrett (53:49.005)
Yeah, I want to kind of forget about the app just generally because it doesn't ever work on my phone. But that's a that's that's a me thing, I guess, as an Android guy. But that that's an interesting thought. And I wish that I understand that, again, that there that it's technically two separate leagues and stuff. But it's all it's all the same umbrella. And it's like, can we just can we just figure out how to make this work?

together. I, you know, I don't know. Anyway, let's move on to the PLL All-Star game where, wait, before we do that, I wanted to ask you. Who surprised you in this WLL game? There's obviously the big names. We know Charlotte North, obviously. If you didn't know Izzy Scane and

Emily Hawryschuk and several of the Sydni Black before the championship series, you were introduced to them there. Who were you introduced to in this game that just like knocked your socks off?

Brandon Hooten (54:56.069)
Rachel Clark was the first one. Seven points, five goals, two assists. She was incredible. I don't know what we have to do get her in the WLL, but that needs to happen immediately. The other one was... I believe it's your girl, Ms. Schweitzer in net. I believe you mentioned her a few weeks ago or a month ago, whatever was. Only 41 % saved, but for an All-Star game, I felt like that was pretty good.

Neil Barrett (54:59.639)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (55:17.846)
I did.

Brandon Hooten (55:23.685)
and seeing her for the first time, I thought was also pretty cool.

Neil Barrett (55:25.366)
Well, and to that point, Taylor Moreno, who's hands down one of the best goalie women's goalies in the game, was at like thirty four, thirty five, something like that. so, yeah, so she she definitely outperformed her. But all star games are not really goalie showcases. So not not the best example there. The one for me, well, there's there's two.

Brandon Hooten (55:36.313)
Yeah, at 35.

Brandon Hooten (55:44.801)
No, no.

Neil Barrett (55:54.604)
And both are names that had kind of broken containment and I knew their names, but I had never seen them play. The first one was Sam Apuzo. I thought she was incredible. I again, I had never seen her play and she totally blew me away. And then the other one was Kinsey Kent who played well, ended up with six points, three goals, three assists, played well, but I was blown away.

Because again, I knew the name from several years ago, you know, when she was playing, I didn't know that she was, she had not been playing lacrosse because she plays women's professional women's hockey. Yeah. So, so she went to, she, presumably she doesn't right now, cause that's why she was playing WLL. But yeah, she was a, she was a PA, PWHL draft pick.

Brandon Hooten (56:38.895)
Is she really? In the PWHL or something else?

Neil Barrett (56:53.686)
She when she was at Boston College, she played women's hockey for Boston College and was barely good at it, clearly, because she was drafted. And that blew me away. I was like, wait, hold on. What? It's like it's like a Jared Bernhardt kind of story that we're not talking about. And we should be. So, yes. Yeah. So she was was the one that that really kind of blew me away. And.

Brandon Hooten (57:15.589)
That's crazy.

Neil Barrett (57:22.922)
It just reminded me, like you said, Rachel Clark, another one that was just crazy, crazy good. And then I don't know, it just was kind of all around a reminder of like there are a bunch of girls on these teams that. I'm not familiar with that are absolute ballers, and. I don't know that you and I can answer this question, but.

Brandon Hooten (57:46.138)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (57:52.598)
Watching the game, I was thinking the whole time, is Charlotte North the best player? Like is that? I think it's kind of generally accepted across the lacrosse community that she is. She's certainly the most high profile if she isn't the best. And she is, of course, she is, of course, a great, great player. But watching the championship series and now the All-Star game, I just kept thinking, man, I don't.

Brandon Hooten (58:09.976)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (58:20.334)
I don't even know if I think she's the best player in the in the league right now. You know, there's there's so many very, very good players. I didn't even talk about, you know, Lizzie Colson and Ali Mastroianni and several of these players that I just really, really love their game. So. With that being said, let's do now move on to the PLL All-Star game, the West beat the East 15 to 13.

This was... I don't know. I don't know. What'd you think? Being there, was it any different?

Brandon Hooten (58:58.052)
I mean it was pretty standard. I thought they were trying more than I thought they would for sure Obviously like you look at the scores early on in this format and it was like, you know 20 plus points each and and now the last two years it's been kind of low scoring and you could tell like they wanted to win for sure like the East when they had a chance to tie it at the end of that game they were Clearly drawing something up. That was an actual play that did not work at all

Neil Barrett (59:04.366)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (59:24.046)
did not work.

Brandon Hooten (59:25.985)
No, but I thought it had a really good mix of like we're trying to win, but we're also trying to have fun. I mean, the first face off was literally a rock, scissors. Like that's fun to me. you know, we had a goalie face off. That's fun to me. You know, you had Pat Cav catching it and throwing it behind the back, like not just behind the back, but like he's facing the opposite direction, you know, on his former teammate. No, I still want to see the GoPro footage cause he had a GoPro on his helmet. We've only seen.

Neil Barrett (59:44.942)
Crazy.

Neil Barrett (59:48.886)
And he never looked.

Brandon Hooten (59:55.876)
Entamins I believe we saw Entamins. Or was it Kurt? Yeah, so I would love to see that, you know his footage But yeah, it was a lot of a lot of cool stuff. I mean Dylan Malloy had a crazy ground ball pickup one hand There was a lot of just a lot of cool stuff then of course my guy Brendan O'Neil with the MVP so What can I say best in the world sometimes?

Neil Barrett (59:58.06)
Yeah, ends with ends, yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:00:19.054)
Brennan O'Neill, when he is relaxed and comfortable and just like playing kind of in the flow of the game. My God, he's so good. Just so good. The the behind the back pass. Wasn't the prettiest thing, but it was just such an example to me of like when he is kind of playing within the flow of the game and is relaxed and comfortable because.

Brandon Hooten (01:00:34.786)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:00:46.638)
because he did everything right on that play in terms of manipulating the slides and pulling them away and creating a space for him to even hit that pass. And it was just like, dude, like you can do this all the time. Like, just do it. It's.

Brandon Hooten (01:01:01.556)
Uh-huh, uh-huh. Some of those plays he was making, was like, bro, you can... Let's take this in the next week. It's doable. And then on top of that, Jake Passino had an incredible day with four points. I mean, he was second on the team in scoring, which is both hilarious and awesome at the same time. But yeah, overall, mean, it was just a fun game. guess that's all, I mean, pretty typical, I thought.

Neil Barrett (01:01:09.452)
Yeah. Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:01:14.478)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (01:01:22.211)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:01:31.459)
Yeah.

People want to complain and be like, this is so dumb and no one's even trying. And I'm like, they're trying. They're just not they're just not going to, you know, dive after loose balls for a game that doesn't mean anything. And they shouldn't. It's an exhibition game. Like, it's fun. I want to see. I mean, I don't want to see people slacking off and not not playing even remotely any. I don't want an NBA All-Star game, but.

Brandon Hooten (01:01:40.568)
They were trying.

Brandon Hooten (01:01:46.391)
Right.

Neil Barrett (01:02:02.606)
there should be a fine line where we're here to have fun, to entertain, you know, and just kind of like bring general awareness. It's the perfect time to try Pat Kavanaugh's. He didn't look at the goal at all. Like he's running up, upfield and then kind of sweeping across a little bit. He catches the ball, never looks at the goal. I had no idea where it was. I think it's, it was.

Brandon Hooten (01:02:17.112)
No.

Neil Barrett (01:02:28.546)
Kind of dumb luck will say, you make your own luck a bit, but kind of dumb luck that it was on target and then just the sheer catching the goalie off guard of it all is why it went in. don't think Liam Intamin, I think he would have saved it if there was any hint that it was coming at all. So.

Brandon Hooten (01:02:51.268)
No, there was a bunch of play like that though that like Like even the ones that missed like the crowd was into every time it was like you heard the crowd you know like that was close like it was it was fun I mean Dylan has had a behind the back that like no one was expecting and he hit it Michael Sowers tried his don't remember if he did the behind the back or between the legs Dodge. Yeah, he tried that Like there was a bunch of just fun plays that I mean Jake Pacino at one point

Neil Barrett (01:02:59.128)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (01:03:11.902)
Between the legs. Yeah, I don't remember either

Brandon Hooten (01:03:19.672)
did a toe drag into like a twister it looked like maybe around the guy like There was a bunch of like just fun stuff and I'm like if any of these land we're looking at a higher scoring game And it just shows the creativity of these dudes that like literally on a whim You know, you're up a ball throwing it behind the back without even looking at it. It's it's crazy

Neil Barrett (01:03:39.694)
Mm hmm. Yeah. No, I thought this game. was the only the only problem with this game, I think, was that you had one half that was dominated by one team and then the other half was dominated by the other team. And so you didn't get a whole lot of the two teams kind of being good at the same time. But other than that, I thought it was good. It was fun. It was entertaining. You know, not too much to complain about. I did want to ask you.

Brandon Hooten (01:03:58.817)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:04:08.19)
what your favorite goal was from the game.

Brandon Hooten (01:04:13.409)
the pack have one hander just throwing that thing in top corner that's that's far and wide the craziest goal of the game

Neil Barrett (01:04:16.864)
Okay. Yeah, yeah, the-

Neil Barrett (01:04:24.46)
Yeah, the behind the back was maybe crazier just because like, who does that? Like, what are we doing? But I think there was...

Brandon Hooten (01:04:35.735)
The thing is I've seen that in box enough times, that style of like facing the other direction, that like it was cool, but it was still just like, all right, I've come to expect that of certain guys, but.

Neil Barrett (01:04:48.48)
Yeah, well, and again, there's an element of like kind of dumb luck to it. as well. That one, the one hander, though, there wasn't luck to that. That was pure skill. The toe drag into it was so clean. And then the one hand, the velocity of that one hand, I was like. What? What the hell? What?

Brandon Hooten (01:04:52.577)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:04:59.316)
No.

Brandon Hooten (01:05:05.654)
Yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:05:13.779)
He's the only other guy aside from Brennan last year that I've seen do that Like as far as like have the velocity behind it the accuracy like we've seen guys, you know throw stuff in randomly but like you're saying like I I I cannot compute in my head how you even hold the ball on your stick like that and Launch it with that velocity on the run on top of having to beat your defender with a toe drag like I Just don't know how he does it

Neil Barrett (01:05:18.733)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:05:37.08)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:05:42.95)
And I know that some Notre Dame person is going to get in the comments and be like, "you're an idiot. He was always like this." I will stand ten toes down on. don't know what in the Popeye's spinach this dude did in the offseason, but this is not the same dude last year. Not the same dude, I think, the previous two years. Not that he wasn't incredibly skilled, incredibly talented.

There's I almost want to say there's like an element of almost like anger that he's playing with. Like he's just mad at the world that he got bounced around and is like out to. I don't know. There's just something about it. I'm like, man, there is just no way that this is the same dude from last year. And I know I know he had some injuries last year, but again, even at Notre Dame, I'm like,

This is not the dude I was watching at Notre Dame. Not that that dude wasn't good and great in his own way, but like this is not the same dude. So.

Brandon Hooten (01:06:44.237)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:06:50.241)
Yeah, but yeah, that's top of my list I think but like I said there was I mean there was a bunch of cool ones I mean Brandon had a pretty cool kind of mid step back type of thing He did he pinged the corner on one that was like just a straight-up shot, but like Precision wasn't The Dylan Hess one was sweet a lot of the two bombs. I thought were cool. Just because of who was shooting them Like like Troy Ray. I thought it was just fun to see I'm trying to think of like what else like who else scored like

Neil Barrett (01:07:12.078)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (01:07:19.427)
crazy goal. But yeah, just a bunch of fun stuff all around.

Neil Barrett (01:07:25.378)
Yeah, I really enjoyed it. And again, again, we're talking about like this is a thing that you don't you don't take too crazy seriously. You get what?

Maybe one practice you're playing with all these dudes that you've never played before with a coach who doesn't necessarily know the ins and out of everybody's skills and stuff like it's supposed to be fun. You're supposed to have holes that that carry it down and would normally maybe make a pass to an attack man. And they're they're going to try and make a dodge and see if they can get a decent shot off. You know, it's it's supposed to be fun. And I.

Brandon Hooten (01:07:40.535)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:07:58.796)
Mm-hmm.

There was actually another one that I just thought of when Sours, he passed it across the middle to Jack Hanna. I don't know how he even placed the pass because I didn't think Jack's stick was really like ready for it, but he caught it with a dude on him and he just did like a quick shovel shot in. That was a cool sequence and especially because it was two water dogs. It was like, okay, you guys are clearly connected here. But sorry, as you were talking, I was like, wait, there was one more and that was awesome as well.

Neil Barrett (01:08:19.543)
Mm-hmm.

Neil Barrett (01:08:29.066)
No, speaking of Jack Hanna, he had that one, though, that he. Shot with so much velocity, it wasn't cool, special, you know, but he just launched it with so much velocity and it hit the back of the net so hard. I was like, like, are you angry at that net? Like, I don't did that thing do something to you? Because I couldn't believe how fast that that shot left his stick and hit the back of the net. I.

Brandon Hooten (01:08:47.938)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:08:58.378)
I really like Jack Hanna's game and it's one that I think every year I feel like he's getting better and better and adding some new wrinkle or whatever. But I've never I've never seen him shoot like that before. As good as as good as he is and as much as I enjoy his game, I've never seen him shoot like that before.

Brandon Hooten (01:09:10.519)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:09:16.576)
Yeah, he was awesome.

Neil Barrett (01:09:19.822)
All right, so that was the All-Star Weekend in an hour and 10 minute conversation. But now we are heading back into the regular season. Week seven will be taking place this weekend from Chicago. Well, Evanston, if you want to be more specific about it.

Brandon Hooten (01:09:42.508)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:09:43.678)
It is throwback weekend. is also the PLL Hall of Fame weekend, I'm pretty sure. And they are also doing a PLL Street event, which I don't know if you even know this because you were there. They said during the broadcast that they have built a PLL Street field, whatever you want to call it turf, I don't know, whatever on a boat. They are going to be doing it out in the water.

this weekend, which is crazy and cool. I'm imagining I don't again. This was the first time I'd heard of it. And I almost wouldn't have believed it, except that when I tweeted about it, several PLO people liked it. So I was like, I guess that I guess that kind of confirms it. But what I'm imagining is that it's going to be in the water right outside of the stadium, because the stadium they're playing in this weekend is right on the edge of the water. And I'm imagining they built it out on the water there. So

Brandon Hooten (01:10:13.783)
Wow.

Brandon Hooten (01:10:27.296)
Interesting.

Neil Barrett (01:10:41.016)
That's going to be pretty cool. I'm really excited to see what that looks like. You and I in in a larger lacrosse group chat that we're in. had a little bit of a discussion this weekend about how or really it was today about how this is kind of the first time this year that there's been something that's been kind of built and hyped a little bit. Talking about heading into throwback weekend.

I, one of my big kind of complaints about this season has been that unlike the previous, what is it? Six seasons, previous five. I can't remember how many are we on season six. We're on seven. So the, okay. So the previous six, I felt like did such a great job building excitement coming into the season. think RJ's daily vlogs during training camp were a big part of that. think

Brandon Hooten (01:11:19.436)
think we're on seven, I believe.

Neil Barrett (01:11:35.434)
Jersey reveals are a big part of that things that get people talking about what's what's going on debating, you know, even even our little arguments about uniforms and stuff, I think are great things for in terms of like building anticipation and hype. And this is the first time that we've done it. RJ did, two vlogs from training camp this year.

There wasn't really a Jersey release much to speak of. They kind of did one, but none of the Jerseys had really major changes. So there just wasn't a lot of hype about that. I don't know. I just felt like the first half of this season has been a little kind of dull. And this is the first time this week for this upcoming weekend that I have really felt like, there's something.

to kind of talk about to get us excited about this week. And with the release of the throwback jerseys earlier today, I think maybe the most fun way that we can look forward to week seven in Chicago is to maybe rank. I don't know, maybe maybe rank. You want to rank them? We can rank them. Loose ranking. I will I will say my caveat whenever I do rankings is

Brandon Hooten (01:12:47.414)
Yeah, it'll be a loose ranking, but we can rank them.

Neil Barrett (01:12:56.046)
I am subject to change my ranking when I see them on the field because sometimes you see these little like flat images of like a jersey laid out somewhere and you think one thing and then you see it in person and you're just like, no, okay, that works. You know, you know who I just had that happen with the Orlando magic. They're new jerseys. Yeah. When you saw them flat, I thought they were good. Like, you know, they, they were okay. But then when I actually saw

Brandon Hooten (01:13:00.598)
Yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:13:16.492)
with their new ones they just released, yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:13:25.422)
guys wearing them after the draft, I was like, oh no, okay, they look a lot better on someone than they did. I know one of the things specifically, and I'm going way too much about the Orlando Magic here, but one of the things specifically was that the text on the front of the jersey that says Magic looked really small in the lay, in the flat versions, but then when you put...

someone put it on and it was actually like wrapped around their body and you could really get a good sense of how big the word mark actually was. It was like, no, okay, looks better. all that to say, I reserved the right to re-rank once I see them on the field. let's start with, you wanna start at the top or you wanna start at the bottom?

Brandon Hooten (01:14:11.841)
Let's go with the bottom. I think, yeah, I think like 99 % of the lacrosse community has the same bottom.

Neil Barrett (01:14:13.806)
I think we have the same bottom, so.

Neil Barrett (01:14:20.072)
I've only I've only heard one person who likes it.

Brandon Hooten (01:14:22.471)
well, I've heard one person who likes it, but I've seen two people who don't have it as the bottom.

Neil Barrett (01:14:31.022)
Who's the other one?

Brandon Hooten (01:14:32.021)
Yeah, I'll have to send you the tweet. I'm blanking on his name. He's a Woods fan.

Neil Barrett (01:14:37.184)
I- you know what? Yes. Yes, you're right. I know who it is. I saw it.

Brandon Hooten (01:14:42.045)
He actually had the two MLL teams as the bottom and I was like, sir. Have you seen Philly's Jersey? But. But.

Neil Barrett (01:14:50.094)
Yeah, well, he also he also had the woods jersey at the top and it is it is not the best one. That's that's one of my that's one of my favorite things about when jerseys drop is all these people pick their their teams jersey to be the best one. And it's like there's no way you actually believe that that is not the best jersey. I can't be in a homer like that is not the best jersey. Come on. Come on. So anyway.

Brandon Hooten (01:14:54.141)
Yes, yes, nah. No, he, yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:15:14.815)
Yeah, but yes, that spoiled it. Philly is at the bottom.

Neil Barrett (01:15:18.83)
Philly is 100 % at the bottom. That green is so bad.

Brandon Hooten (01:15:24.095)
I just don't understand like the purpose.

Neil Barrett (01:15:28.406)
The only thing that I could thought what that I thought was. There's there's two things. One, I think maybe the thing that they're actually going for is some kind of connection to the Eagles. I know that's that's what I was talking about. I don't understand that because they're not related to the PLL in any way. They're not related to the water dogs other than, you know, being a Philly, another Philly sports team. They have no relation to them. So like it doesn't make sense.

Brandon Hooten (01:15:41.889)
Okay.

Neil Barrett (01:15:58.584)
But you know what it it reminded me of the first time I saw it was the New Jersey Devils throwback jerseys that have like the Italian flag colors. They're like original New Jersey Devil colors, the red, white and green. That's what it reminded me of. And I was like, are we trying to do like a a New Jersey Devils kind of thing in Philly? I.

Brandon Hooten (01:16:24.001)
That's interesting.

Neil Barrett (01:16:26.136)
I'm sure that that's not what they were going for, but it was the first thing I thought of. I was like, I don't, I don't know about this. So anyway.

Brandon Hooten (01:16:33.407)
I also really hate the shoulder pad looking thing. The purple, that is something for me that's like kind of a deal breaker on like all jerseys, it just feels very strange. Like almost like you're a doorman that has like, you know, like the pads type of thing. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm not, not a huge fan of that either.

Neil Barrett (01:16:49.134)
The epaulettes. Yeah.

You know, I said that last year when when their purple with the white shoulder came out. I said that, but then when I saw it on field, it's one of those ones that I'm not saying I was like, it's the best jersey ever once I saw it on the field. But once I saw it on the field, I was like, you know what? I like it better than I thought I did again, seeing it on a flat, you know, just in an image didn't do it justice. It didn't. I don't think it even really like change spots, but it did change my mind just a little bit.

Brandon Hooten (01:16:56.893)
Yes, did not like that.

Neil Barrett (01:17:21.646)
But anyway, we both have Philly at eight. Who do you have at seven?

Brandon Hooten (01:17:26.045)
I'm putting Maryland at seven. Personally.

Neil Barrett (01:17:29.294)
you and I are not in agreement on that Maryland Jersey.

Brandon Hooten (01:17:32.202)
I'm not even gonna waste my time arguing it because we already talked about it. All I will tell the viewers is I don't like the striping, where it is, it looks weird to me and I feel like there's too much red on the front of the jersey. I feel like last year they went all yellow and it was too much yellow and we all said that and now this year they like overcorrected and didn't put enough yellow. I would have liked to see maybe a double striping on the numbers. or on the Maryland.

to where you have like a black and a yellow or just something like that.

Neil Barrett (01:18:06.654)
I'm not gonna rebut you. will give my rebuttal when I rank Maryland. My number seven is California. That jersey looks so dumb. And I'm going to tell the audience what I said to you that you did not understand because you are freaking younging. It looks to me like it...

Brandon Hooten (01:18:29.281)
you

Neil Barrett (01:18:34.21)
came from a straight to DVD American Pie movie and Brandon didn't know what American Pie was, which just broke my brain. How do you not know what American Pie is? In his defense, you were, what'd you say? It was before you were born when the first one? Which, my God, that makes me feel so old. What was it? Was it 99? Is that what it was? 99? Yeah, it was in ninth grade. Cool. Great. Thank you.

Brandon Hooten (01:18:47.809)
The first one came out, yeah, before I was born, so.

Yeah.

99, yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:19:02.241)
There you go. You're welcome, you're welcome.

Neil Barrett (01:19:03.404)
Thank you for that. But yeah, it I don't know. It just looks cheap and cheesy. And last year, I thought there's looked like kind of a throwback, like PE uniform. And I kind of liked it. I didn't have it ranked super high, but I did kind of like it. This year, they took everything, everything that was not good about last year's jersey and kind of like cranked it up to 10 and gave me none of what was good about it. I personally

I'm not a big fan of that bear logo. It's a little too cartoony for me. It doesn't feel retro. It feels cartoony. And so I'm just not a big fan of that bear logo. So, yeah, so I got them at seven. Who do you have at six?

Brandon Hooten (01:19:48.876)
I have California at six.

think it's fine it's just I prefer the last year logo with the California California redwoods one of the two behind the bear kind of like with the bear on top of it almost this one I personally I hate calling California Cali I despise it that's a personal thing it has nothing to do with like the Jersey so I don't like that automatically yeah and I just

Neil Barrett (01:19:59.214)
Mm-hmm.

Brandon Hooten (01:20:20.158)
I also just think it looks strange because they have a US bank sponsorship that's red and blue and then they have the black Lexus over here and I recognize that's a necessary thing but I just don't love it and again like you could have a green jersey I love the green so and I recognize like the matchups play into like the color decisions but I would have personally like to see them go green or even yellow and just mix in more white unlike Maryland last year.

Neil Barrett (01:20:46.806)
Yeah, I didn't I didn't say this on mine, but. California this year is what Carolina was last year, like it's just a complete kind of misstep, like there's nothing necessarily bad or like incorrect about it. It's just not there's just nothing good about it either. So for me, number six is Boston.

Brandon Hooten (01:21:07.38)
Yeah, yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:21:15.977)
Nostalgia aside, they're not they're not good jerseys like their ugly jerseys. I didn't like them. I didn't like them in 2001 when they were the Boston Canons jerseys. I don't like them now. They're not good jerseys. There are. There are way better ways. First of all, there are way better Boston Canons jerseys that they could have chosen from. And second, by and large, I think the warrior New Balance

MLL jerseys were not good. They just weren't. they were heavily templated. Everybody looked basically the same. The one the one that didn't look the same that looked amazing was the Bayhawks with the feathers on it. And they got rid of it to go to a template. And everyone was like, what are you doing? So I'm just not a big fan of those

Brandon Hooten (01:21:51.187)
Okay.

Brandon Hooten (01:22:09.619)
Okay.

Neil Barrett (01:22:14.422)
just across the board. I think you could have done a nod to those without actually trying to basically like one to one recreate them. Also, this is a very small thing. And I honestly, if I really think about it, I'm not sure how I feel about it. But something about it kind of bugs me that you're doing this throwback weekend and like everybody has these porthole mesh jerseys except for the two teams doing MLL throwbacks.

who are doing like a more traditional like 90s mesh jersey style. Part of me kind of appreciates it because I don't want everyone to be the same and I'm not I don't I don't really love porthole mesh either. part of me kind of likes it. But there's something that feels weird about seeing it. I don't know. It's just something that is kind of killing me about it. And I can't quite figure out what it is.

Brandon Hooten (01:22:58.59)
Yeah, me neither.

Brandon Hooten (01:23:06.729)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:23:13.258)
fair. What are we on number five?

We're at number five, correct? Alright, number five. this is so difficult. I reserve the right to change this. Everyone listening.

Neil Barrett (01:23:21.463)
Yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:23:33.985)
I'm gonna go with New York as my number five. I absolutely love their colors. I love the navy. I love the main details being like a cream with an accent of the sky, navy, or baby blue, whatever. The thing I really dislike about it, A, I don't love porthole generally like you were saying, but also it reminds me too much of the chrome lettering.

which I like on the chrome. just feels like they are like, it doesn't belong to me. Also the sleeves, I feel like it's a missed opportunity. Like I recognize that most of these jerseys have the same style sleeve, but like Utah, says Utah, Carolina looks like they have something on theirs. Maryland has the logo, you know, so I just, feel like there should have been a bowl or something, an A, I don't know.

because of the color scheme, that's why it's higher than the other two portholes or three portholes so far for me.

Neil Barrett (01:24:42.05)
You're really not going to my number five. I have the Denver Outlaws at number five for this for the same reasons. Basically, just I just don't really like the the design of those jerseys. If they had done the white one, I would probably have put it a little higher. The black with the gray panel. I just I never really liked that that jersey.

You know, I'm going to be really interested to see. Presumably, these are going to be the same, specifically those two, the Utah or the the Denver and the Boston one. I'm assuming they're going to be the same like PLL jersey that were used to the kind of the soccer. Right. That's going to be really, really weird.

Brandon Hooten (01:25:31.592)
Yeah, it looks like it. To me.

Neil Barrett (01:25:38.774)
because those those jerseys were designed as like big, you know, baggy cut, you know, traditional jerseys. So it's going to be really interesting to see what these look like. They they could legitimately fall seeing them on the field. I just broke my pen. Right. They could legitimately fall farther seeing them on the field. They could be really awkward. They might also move up. Just I don't know. We'll see. But

Brandon Hooten (01:25:43.317)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:26:07.65)
Yeah, I'm going Denver. The one thing I will say I do like, they're wearing the orange shorts. So that's what's in the store is orange shorts for them, right? Did I make that up?

Brandon Hooten (01:26:14.495)
Are they?

Brandon Hooten (01:26:19.038)
Okay. I thought I saw black, but maybe I missed on.

Neil Barrett (01:26:24.51)
no, you're right. You you are right. They're black. It's the archers that are wearing orange shorts. You're right. So, OK, I take back what I said and I don't that's not going to save them.

Brandon Hooten (01:26:26.058)
Yeah, they were in black, yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:26:30.302)
Yes, yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:26:37.652)
Yeah, no, my number four is going to be...

going between the two that's so tough I'm gonna put the outlaws at four it's probably not fair for what I'm gonna say but again we have a specialty Jersey and again we're doing black can we please stop doing black we have orange as a primary color it should be I should say we can make an orange Jersey this next week indigenous week we better have an orange Jersey or I'm going to lose my mind all right I hope they're listening I will buy a million of them please give us an orange Jersey

Besides the point though, nostalgia wise it's awesome seeing the old logo back on there. I like having a bit of orange kind of on the sleeves. I just think that the sleeves are a bit awkward with like how those kind of go. I also noticed this, I believe and also the Boston ones are the only ones that have like the silver shield PLL shield on the back. Everyone else has the yellow one. So depending on how you feel about that. And the last thing is I don't like the white color.

Neil Barrett (01:27:30.776)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:27:45.566)
I wish they would have just done, you know, orange, gray, black, whatever. But overall, I think it's a solid jersey and it's a step in the right direction because last year I was wanting their throwback to be a legit throwback since they had access to it. I just wish they would have done orange overall. But again, I also prefer that style over the porthole. So there's that.

Neil Barrett (01:27:46.84)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:28:05.964)
Yeah. Yeah. This is one of the things that I've talked about for a long time, especially around Syracuse when they wear their like early 2000s throwbacks and they they aren't really throwbacks because like the idea of a throwback is that you're taking kind of the look and feel of the older jersey, but putting it on like a current kind of like cut and materials and stuff like that. And

Every year that Syracuse wears their throwbacks, they just wear the like 1999 jersey that's like got their bellies hanging out and, you know, has these big giant arms that hang down. And it's like you're not wearing a throwback. You're just wearing the 1999 jersey. And that's kind of the way I feel about these those Denver outlaws was that if, like you said, I recognize that the collar was white in the original jersey, but

Brandon Hooten (01:28:51.795)
Right.

Neil Barrett (01:29:03.63)
It doesn't have to be white on this one. It could be. I realize. I realize that the outlaws didn't really do an orange jersey other than the the Star Wars one that they did. That's the only one I can remember. They may have done one here or there. Did they? Oh, that's right. That's right. Like the 20, the 2017 with like the black sleeves. Yeah, yeah, Yes, yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:29:05.8)
Yes.

Brandon Hooten (01:29:15.401)
Well they did have an orange one. They had a majority orange one. That was awesome.

Brandon Hooten (01:29:24.755)
Yes. So you can do it. But I am thankful though that they're at least doing this while Eric Law is still playing. Because I can get an Eric Law jersey and it be like something he played in. There was air quotes there for all the audio listeners. But, so I do appreciate that versus last year when it was like just porthole.

Neil Barrett (01:29:39.489)
You

Neil Barrett (01:29:46.144)
Yeah, like where am I going to wear a porthole mesh jersey? I'm not showing my nipples to everybody. Come on. For number four, I have Utah. Honestly, I literally right before we pressed record, I recognized that there's a detail in the collar that I hadn't seen before. I don't know.

Brandon Hooten (01:29:49.31)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:30:09.299)
I would assume that's like the mountains or something.

Neil Barrett (01:30:11.852)
Yeah, I think that's kind of the idea of it. is. It's a kind of a triangle zigzag pattern. But it was something I hadn't noticed before. And I was like, because we'll just I'll just go ahead to three. have New York at three. I really, really love those color combos. I really love that font. I do agree with you that I think the the sleeves, while not bad, could use something.

So maybe I would I would switch either way whether I would switch them or not I'm not too pressed if somebody has Utah, but if if those are switched those They're they're such similar jerseys. I do think right off the top of my head I would put Utah above them because I do like some of the added details. I don't really love their sleeves. But again, there's a little bit of detail I am really stoked to see

New York and all Navy. They have those great Navy helmets and I've been begging for more Navy uniform elements. They should be in all Navy this weekend. I think, of course, now that I've said it, they're probably going to come out on the light blue helmets with the blue on blue with the Navy on Navy, which would be a colossal.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:12.413)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:25.907)
I'd be fine with that.

Neil Barrett (01:31:29.39)
Come on man. They need to be in all Navy this weekend. That needs to be.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:34.259)
problem is they've already worn the Navy helmets twice this year.

Neil Barrett (01:31:37.358)
I don't care. I don't care. They got two helmets. They got to wear them four and four or five and five, I guess.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:42.949)
Don't they technically have three helmets because they have the white as well?

Neil Barrett (01:31:49.526)
I don't think they have the white this year.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:52.649)
Did they just go straight to Navy?

Neil Barrett (01:31:54.956)
I think so. think the Navy replaced the white.

Brandon Hooten (01:31:57.841)
Okay, if that's the case then yes, go Navy. I was under the impression they still had the whites as well.

Neil Barrett (01:32:03.854)
I don't think so, I think they've... No team has ever had a third helmet.

Brandon Hooten (01:32:09.567)
Well that's what I thought, but then I was like, maybe they just want to introduce it since it was the Champ series favorite. But maybe I'm... I'm misremembering it.

Neil Barrett (01:32:15.917)
I mean.

Neil Barrett (01:32:21.388)
No, I don't know. I haven't seen the white on anything that they've done this year, which like, why don't they? Why don't we just have third helmets at this point? Why don't we have third jerseys at this point? I don't know. So, yeah, Utah, though, with the orange shorts, I think is going to be a really, really good look. So, yeah, I should probably switch those. I'll put New York at four and Utah at three. Who do you have for three?

Brandon Hooten (01:32:34.451)
Anyway.

Brandon Hooten (01:32:45.375)
I've been going back and forth but after looking at the backs of these I'm gonna put the Boston cannons at three The front of the jersey I really like because I like the colors and I do like having like that altar a tertiary or however many different logos they have logo on there that like you're not normally seeing I Dislike the triangle at the collar. We got let's get away from that, please, especially next week for indigenous week. We don't need that again

The back, I don't like the font. I don't like how the numbers continue and collide into each other and it's just like that's bad. And then like the framing of it where the player, that's a little bit weird. But the colors are awesome. I like the sides of the jersey having the logo.

And again, I like the material a ton. But there's just some minor tweaks that is holding it back from being top two to me.

Neil Barrett (01:33:44.806)
That's another one for me where it's just a remake. All you did was take the 2002 Boston Canaan jersey and just, or I guess it's probably the 2001 Boston Canaan jersey and just, just completely, it's the same thing. Just in a, and I guess a PLL cut. And I'm, I don't know. I'm not feeling it. I'd much rather see them take some of those elements. Like you said, I love the,

the Sea Cannon logo. I would have loved to see them do to create something with it. Yeah, I would have liked to see them do something with it to create something with it. And they didn't. And that's why I have them solo. Who do you have for number two?

Brandon Hooten (01:34:18.878)
I like the bomb logo too.

Brandon Hooten (01:34:41.256)
Number two, I have Utah. As much as I hate the porthole, I'm a sucker for blue and orange for obvious reasons. The sleeves, these are the best sleeves, I think, out of all the jerseys. Not only does it say Utah, but it has a little cartoon Utah archer dude, which is cool. I like that there's something on the collar, although most times I'm a little bit leery on like doing mountains and stuff, because I think it is overplayed for Colorado and Utah, but I do like it.

Neil Barrett (01:35:09.708)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:35:11.1)
generally speaking.

Neil Barrett (01:35:13.878)
And I like that it's not it's not mountains, you know, it could be an inter it could be interpreted as mountains, but otherwise it could it could just be a design, you know,

Brandon Hooten (01:35:18.002)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:35:24.272)
Right, but yeah, and then I just think like the that old-school blocking. I think it's probably the best of the bunch in my mind So, yeah, I got it too

Neil Barrett (01:35:32.387)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:35:39.854)
Okay, for me at two, I have Maryland. I love the shoulder stripes. I, you know, when you said the part about like double outlining the numbers, I was like, you know what? I'll give you that. think that would, it would not only look better. I think it would tie into the jersey better, you know, kind of mimicking the shoulder stripe. I can somewhat understand what you're saying about the shape of the stripe and how it kind of comes down to a point and everything.

I that doesn't bother me though. I get that it's a little funky. It doesn't really bother me. I actually think they use the colors really well. I would don't get me wrong. I would absolutely prefer them to be for this jersey to be red and teal and black and go back to the old Whipsnakes color scheme. But I'm not going to hold a

PLL choice that was made several years ago against this specific jersey. I personally do think that the red, yellow and black color scheme works. I know not everyone agrees, but I do. And there's something about this that apps it to me what we talked about. We talked about, you know, both the cannons and the outlaws, both not.

not kind of taking elements and creating something new out of it. But just recreating one for one a jersey. This one feels like all of the best ways to do a throwback or I guess in this case, most of these, with the exception of of Denver and Boston, are really more faux backs because we're throwing back to a history that doesn't exist.

Brandon Hooten (01:37:33.907)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:37:34.062)
So I guess it's more of a of a faux back, but to me it's all done the right way. It feels like something that has

actual history to it. I sent you guys an image in the group chat of some actual guys from like the 60s and 70s wearing, you know, striped shoulder. And there's just something about it that just has always echoed that to me. And it and it works for me. get design is subjective and we all have our own opinions about it. So I'm not I'm not really all that mad at anyone for their rankings. I just think you're crazy. That's fine. Totally fine. But

Brandon Hooten (01:38:17.342)
Bye.

Neil Barrett (01:38:18.678)
It sounds like we both have, which kind of surprises me because I don't know that we have talked about it, it sounds like we both have Carolina at number one.

Brandon Hooten (01:38:25.82)
Yeah, yeah, they Finally nailed one. I feel like it took them a while. Not huge on the font of the numbers, but it does feel very throwback-like, almost like someone's doing it by hand and just like... whatever. But the Carolina font is awesome. I love that. I like... I don't understand the diamonds, maybe you do, but I like... it's a good touch that have something there, both on the collar and on the sleeves, in addition to having kind of that black...

Neil Barrett (01:38:31.107)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:38:55.92)
and it's white stripe in the middle of the red I think looks awesome. And I'm also noticing now that looking at this they have the logos on top of the shoulders. This is what I want the water dogs to do. I don't need the outline around them. I just want the logo. Just sit there flat. So very well done, especially after last year's state debacle. This is much better.

Neil Barrett (01:39:10.796)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:39:18.914)
Yeah, yeah, you know, they're there. Was it the first throwback weekend or was it the second where they I think it was maybe the second where they did the black mesh with the red numbers and and everything that one was. Was it the first year? I can't.

Brandon Hooten (01:39:34.046)
I think that was the first, I believe. Cause I think, I think I shot them two, now three seasons ago when they were in white. Last year they did state and now this is this year. I believe I could be, could be totally off though.

Neil Barrett (01:39:46.604)
Okay.

Either way, their last black jersey was pretty good. This one, though, for me, they nailed this one like every I love all of the details. Like you said, the little white stripe in. I think last year they just had the red stripes. And then this year they added the white, which looks amazing. The diamonds, I believe.

Again, I didn't create this. wasn't involved in the meetings. I believe is two things. One, they have the checker pattern already on their current uniforms, which is supposed to be kind of a nod to the racing culture of the area. I believe it's both kind of a play on that as well as a reference to the University of North Carolina Tar Heels argyle pattern. Obviously this is not a full argyle.

It's just kind of diamonds, but that's kind of what I think we're somewhat kind of alluding to. Again, last year they did NC State. This year they're doing a little bit of a nod to Carolina. Another thing that Carolina does is this script thing. Not in this font. One of the things that I like about this is that both the University of North Carolina and the University of South Carolina both do

a script Carolina. So I think this is a nod to kind of both of those. And then, like you said, the logos on the shoulders are amazing. I cannot believe they're the only team that does it. Like you said, Billy would be such a good thing to do that with two caveats. One, I don't know how I feel about the yoke.

Neil Barrett (01:41:45.952)
I'd be fine if they got rid of it. But the dog paw print thing that they're doing on the show, those are not the logos that they should have up there. Those look those look like a middle school team. My middle school was the Guilford Middle School Tigers. I'm pretty sure we had this exact logo on it. They look like a middle school logo. So yeah, I'm not super crazy about that. But Carolina did it right in using an actual like tertiary logo.

Brandon Hooten (01:41:56.327)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:42:15.338)
up there that, yeah, I'm just I couldn't think of anything to improve this, this Jersey. They're the only ones that I could say that about.

Brandon Hooten (01:42:24.871)
Just make it not porthole and there you go.

Neil Barrett (01:42:28.844)
If it wasn't porthole, I would absolutely buy it. And I'm not a Chaos fan to speak of, I would absolutely buy it.

Brandon Hooten (01:42:33.105)
Yep. Also, as regards to the entire collection, I very much appreciate all the sponsorships, at least the Lexus sponsorship, not being on top of the sleeves, the logos, as they currently are on the regular jerseys. So thank you to the league for doing that, because it bothers me so much when I look at some of these jerseys this year, and it's smacked up in the middle of the logo on the shoulder. So great detail there.

Neil Barrett (01:42:49.454)
On the regular. Yep.

Neil Barrett (01:43:00.012)
Yeah. Yep. Yeah. So. It's really crazy to me that we both had Billy at the bottom and Carolina at the top and then everything in the middle is completely different. So.

Brandon Hooten (01:43:12.989)
Yeah.

Neil Barrett (01:43:15.374)
Anyway, with that being said, we are going to get out of here. That is going to do it for this week's episode of The Runout. If you liked what you heard, please drop a rating, leave a comment or share it with someone who loves the game of lacrosse. You can find me at I am Neil Barrett on both Instagram and Twitter. Brandon is at Hoot Sports Media, which is really hard for me to say for some reason.

And then the show itself is at run out pod on both Twitter and Instagram. Come argue with us, send a hot take or ask a question for a future episode. But with that all being said, we will be back next week with more and we will catch you guys then. So cool. Wow. I really, really screwed that up. I'm trying to read it and I screwed it up. So.

Brandon Hooten (01:44:10.845)
Bye.

Neil Barrett (01:44:12.398)
With that being said, we will be back next week with more. I still screwed it up. I still can't say it. You know what? We'll see you next week. And until then, as always, we'll catch you in the comments.

Brandon Hooten (01:44:21.532)
Yeah.

Brandon Hooten (01:44:27.197)
You